Heavy's Axis Power Craps Forum

After reading through the "Dave's System" thread again I understand I am in no position to argue with something that has been working for someone/anyone, but that plan just doesn't work for me. It seems I get too many targets out there and a couple get picked off and it's time to take down my odds (if you stick to the plan) and let the hand play out. I've just not been able to make any money with that strategy. Congrats to those who are!

If you are a darksider and are comfortable with just the DP and DC, how many bets/numbers do you have out there at once? I've been having moderate success with just two numbers/bets at once. $10 DP line bet, $30 odds no matter what the number and a $10 DC with $30 odds when that travels (assuming it does).

Funny thing is I have almost the identical results if I try to get two bets on the board that aren't a 6/8. I will still let the 6/8 travel but not place odds on them and just add another DC. In this case I can run up as many as four bets at once. I really need a well timed 7-out to make that work, though.

For the rest of you, what is the number of bets you are comfortable with from the darkside?

2 DC bets is my norm. If the love is not there I will revert to a single DP to watch how things go. If it gets uglier transition to the do or wal and play some vp.

I have played with Dave. I made him tons and cost him tons. Back inn the day we were regulars Saturday morningsin Joliet and played later at the old Empress. He followed the strategy. He was not afraid to buy in several times and take hours to recoup. On the other hand I've seen him leavew with a suitable profit after 20 minutes on a frigid table.

You can't stay to long. Try shorter sessions and see what happens.

Good Luck

Golfer

I'll play all the numbers on the Don't when I'm waiting for my turn amongst 3 other shooters. The only condition is that none of them look like DI's. On someone who appears to really know what he's doing as a DI, I'll sit it out until he's made 3-4 points, then bet against him. Used to be, I'd go DC and $30 Lay except for the 4/10 which I wouldn't lay. The last two times I played, I layed the 4/10, too. I'm probably ahead with that bet but it feels "even". I'm thinkin' about laying the 4/10 if it's the first point as a hedge against the following $10 DC--that way, a 7 doesn't break even... but once the second $10 goes to a box number, I'm thinkin' of taking the Lay 4/10 down. As good as the odds are on the 4/10, it just doesn't feel like it's been an overwhelmingly good bet in live play. Certainly no 2-1; and sure, ya can't expect it to be an overall resultant 2-1, sometimes the 4 or 10 has to roll, but it sure seems like too many times.

Two hits and all my odds are naked--I won't lay the repeaters, and I'll take the 4/10 odds down, but everything else rides, hoping for the 7. If the table's too choppy, I'll convert to Grafstein's Don't grind--$10 DC's only (no DP ever), 1 bet when a 6/8 rolls, 2 bets if a 5/9 rolls, and 3 bets if a 4/10 rolls... a 5,6,8, or 9 comes up first and then a 4/10, I'll bet the third $10 DC and wait for the 7.

It may sound counter-intuitive because the better odds are with the 4/10, but I've had good success keeping the 5/9 and 6/8 Lays up despite the weaker payoffs.

One DP wager, usually naked.

LOL. Just last week I had six of them up. DP plus all five remaining box numbers. As the shooter rolled the sixth number without a repeater I said "bases loaded." At which point he tossed one repeater, then sevened out. Sometimes I flirt with the dark side. Sometimes I get really committed to it.

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In a craps game ANYTHING CANhappen........
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When you have the benefit of measuring trends ,you may choose to play into them....
There are times when the dice results are choppy and both DO SIDE and DON'T SIDE lose.
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At times there may be a REPEATING NUMBERS RUN or PROLONGED TREND...
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It may require some observation.
Even at that ,there is no LAW that ALL SHOOTERS have exactly the same results,or toss the same numbers in sequence...
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You may observe four shooters go Point Seven Out back to back,Then one shooter toss ELEVEN TIMES
prior to tossing the SEVEN and not repeat even one number.........
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How about some series that just seems to go on for three hours
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This could happen however it is rare if it were to go on for three hours....

Say you observe that ALL the shooters are repeating their FIRST Pass Line wager
( WHATEVER NUMBER IT IS).....

Then ,in turn each shooter tosses the seven out shortly after establishing P/L number two.....
......Would you say it looks trendy
that the shooters are repeating their first P/L and going out soon after setting P/L number two..

If you Identified such as a TREND
Would you Wager the P/L as a PLACE WAGER
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THEN
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TRANSITION to the DON'T PASS for P/L number two ?
..........or perhaps P/L number three should there be a number three..
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We could play some hypothetical virtual game any which way
HOWEVER only the real live event matters.
Gather enough books of actual rolls and WAR GAME IT.....Still it only counts when it is for real.

How long to get beat up or how many lost $ till you stop? Individual choice.

No Lay,Single Lay,Double Lay Lay to the house limit? good questions....
Only RISK WHAT YOU CAN AFFORD TO LOSE!!!!!!!!

NO LAY or Single LAY may extent your play time should the TREND PLAY OUT or CHANGE....
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To start out and at least until you gain some proficiency with this game.

Per sequence you only can make ONE P/L and there are people who argue to LAY or NOT LAY the D/P.

Many times there may be the opportunity to wager more than only one Don't Come
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Because you are facing more chances to take RISK
many people are more comfortable with just the FLAT WAGER with
NO LAY on DON'T/COME WAGERS

especially when the
Don't Come numbers roll on beyond two or three

Should you make two or three D/C wagers with ZERO LAY and lose one D/C to a number repeating
you are still ahead .............( many people are more comfortable only risking TWO D/C wagers )
should your other wagers win if/when the SEVEN shows while they are in play .......
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We may have differing tolerances to LOSS......I mostly select ZERO LAY or at most SINGLE LAY
along with the $$ at RISK in the D/C WAGER...........at this time as I am not so active now.
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Wagering on either side of the dice , you may choose to EXIT
the session when you reach or near your LOSS LIMIT......
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When you perceive that a DARK SIDE TREND HAS ENDED because the shooter or shooters
are repeating numbers........
..........
YOU HAVE CHOICES
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Continue gambling as you were and loosing ever more $$$$$$$
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STAND AT THE CRAPS TABLE..........in T U M A MODE
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TRANSITION TO THE SIDE THAT IS DEFINITELY TRENDING REPEATING NUMBER(S) CITY
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Leave in search of a table fitting your previously selected and chosen mode of play.
...........
Find someone or something to blame ( other than self)..............
............ PULL OUT YOUR MAX FROM THE ATM
and wade right back in attempting to support the casino's BOTTOM LINE
and beg fora Complementary BARFFETTE .................
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Just me saying

W C

In my earlier days I sometime played the Dice Doctor DC method where you bet on the don't until you lose one bet and then just wait for the bets to resolve them self.

The best you can do is all six numbers without a repeater followed by a seven out.

In all the time I played it, I can only remember two times, I got on all six numbers and won them all.

Don't remember how often I got up on all six numbers and then had them all picked off by repeaters before the seven came.

Noah

This really depends on the trend of the table and our bankroll. I'll do just one or two to start and see how they resolve. From there I'll decide. The more I'm making the more I'll place. So if there are few picks I might do 3-5. If the table feels short or I'm below my buy in I'll just do one or two.

L's new favorite play is to bet the DP, lay $60 odds on the point and place across with a DC bet. For each placed winner she uses the winnings to lay odds on the traveling DC bet and then removes the placed bet. Two weekends ago we had our monthly craps game/tournament on our home table and she won because she got this to work just about perfectly twice in a row. All five DC bets traveled with only 1 repeater then a 7out. She was a happy camper that night. Neither of us has had the nerve to try it in live casino play, but we saw two hands this past weekend where it would have been perfect. I remember because the guy next to us was come betting and had just gotten all the numbers with a come bet and $50 - $100 odds when the seven came.