Heavy's Axis Power Craps Forum

So, here's my question. Sorry if this has been answered before or if my lack of knowledge makes me look like a rookie. Maybe this is the wrong forum anyway?

I understand the basic concept of playing the donts. I have yet to do it after playing this game for about 15+years. I suspect that part of that reason is because I am not a regular, every so-often player, due to family and work, blah-blah. I sporadically get to play and when I do, I crave the "woo-hoo" when the whole table is winning. I accept that I am hoping to catch a winner with lots of randies, and I can live with that.

But, suppose you are playing in a casino that has a fire bet or the ATS. If you have $5 on the fire or ATS and the shooter is one from the prize, how do (or do you) hedge and "lay" the needed number? What pays what? How do you call it? What is your kryptonite when you think you have a guaranteed $$?

The concept makes sense, but how do you implement it?

I hope somebody can illuminate this. I don't understand the question. You are not the shooter and you have $5 on the fire or ATS. You have no power to do anything about it. The shooter either makes the number or he/she doesn't. What are you hedging? I understand a hedge bet on a DC..drop $2 on the yo to cover or hop sevens on the CO with numbers WOTCO. So..someone smarted me up about this.

So, it is a bit different depending upon if it is the ATS or Fire Bet. But $5 on tall pays 35 for 1 or $175, $5 on the small pays the same and $5 on the all pays 175 to 1 = $875. So you win the small and are waiting on the tall since you haven't had an eleven. If the 11 shows, you win the tall and the all ($175 + 875=$1050). How would you lay the 11 so you have a bet that the 7 shows before the 11? I suppose (but do not know how the lay works) if the point is made, you lose the lay bet. How much do you lay? Do you lay?

With the Fire Bet, if 5 points have been hit, then that missing number, once set as the point, is worth $5000. So, do you lay it, once set, for a large $$ amount ($1000) so if the 7 shows up, and crashes the Fire Bet, you win something vs. the 7?

You need to ask the dealer to lay the number for a specific amount - or ask him "how much do I need to lay on this number to win x amount of dollars"

The payments on the lay are the inverse of what you would get on free odds bets on the passline and then you have to pay a small commission on top - the vig.

Odds paid are 1/2 for 4 or 10, 2/3 for 5 or 9, 5/6 for 6 or 8 and then you have to pay the vig which is 5% of the expected win. Others will need to chip in here on the exact vig amount as I can't remember how they do the rounding (we do things a bit differently here in the UK)

So 300 lay wins you 150 on 4/10, 200 on 5/9 and 250 on 6/8.......less your vig.

Dancineagle86 wrote:So, here's my question. Sorry if this has been answered before or if my lack of knowledge makes me look like a rookie. Maybe this is the wrong forum anyway?



But, suppose you are playing in a casino that has a fire bet or the ATS. If you have $5 on the fire or ATS and the shooter is one from the prize, how do (or do you) hedge and "lay" the needed number? What pays what? How do you call it? What is your kryptonite when you think you have a guaranteed $$?

The concept makes sense, but how do you implement it?

You can only lay the number needed for the ATS if it's a box number, 4,5,6,8,9,10. If it's a 2,3,11,12 you're sol.

On the 6 and 8 every $6.00 you lay gets you $5.00. Example $30.00 lay six or eight pays $25.00 and you'll have to pay a $1.00 commission or vig.

On the 5 and 9 every $3.00 bet gets you $2.00. Example. $30.00 lay nine or five pays $20.00 - $1.00 vig.

On the 4 and 10 every $2.00 bet gets you $1.00.

Example $40.00 laid on the 4 or 10 pays $20.00 - $1.00 vig.

If you decide to do it just put your chips in the come box and tell the dealer "Lay the 9" or whatever number it is.

$30.00 increments will work for any number but you will be giving up a little extra vig on the 4 or 10 as they'll still charge you a dollar.

Personally, I wouldn't lay any more than 50% of the expected win if the ATS number was hit.