The "Famous" Scoblete Five Count

[wild child]

Heavy

Being inept enough to get EIGHTY-SIXED is DYNAMICS applied by THE HOUSE.

W C

[Kelph]

irish,

Perhaps I was unclear or just plain wrong in how I stated it but your inundation is the point I was trying in my feeble way to communicate. Short term results can be different than Long Term expectations without screwing with probability. The "ways" various numbers can appear on the dice means that given enough throws those with more ways to show will do so as within the hierarchy we all know.

There was no intent to suggest numbers are catching up or need to appear more often than expected as compensation but I certainly see how my use of "overcome and right" could be interpreted that way. Clearly as the numbers continue to be generated in volume their natural order is the ocean in which any short term aberration becomes a drop of statistical insignificance.

Of course that drop of insignificance is where I play.

Kelph

[batipoker9]

In my world,every roll brings the shooter one roll nearer to terminating the hand.

I don't believe any numbers, in this case a seven, are ever due. But I do agree with the above statement, since rolls will eventually end. Are my own thoughts contradictory?

This is my first time posting, but I love the game of craps, and I'm interested in this five count. Does anybody know where I can read more about it? Thanks.

[bounce the bones]

Honestly qualifying a shooter.

90% of all controled shooters are random and clueless actually some of them speard there dice over a bigger section of the table than some that pick and flic.

So for my money it is all about come bets full odds.

After i have been paid for three hits i will put up a second after collecting another three i will have three in play and max it out at that adding a line bet.

Why the house expects to win zero on my odds so i only have a minimum at risk over the long haul and it has a very low house edge

[bounce the bones]

They were not at a dice table when they got bounced.

They have come up with a method of playing pai gow that takes the all ready little house edge away from the house even more.

It is very uniqe idea playing a game for the comp value when you can get the house edge down to almost nothing but still get the full comp value.

Many articles have been written about figuring your comps into your wins for it is money you did not have to spend to aquire what you did

[Mad Professor]

I'm not a big fan of counting your comps as part of your cash winnings.

~Let's say you get a comped suite with a normal rack-rate of $350; are you going to count that as winnings?

I wouldn't.

~How about the comped casino-tickets to a concert with a face-value of $150; are you going to count those?

I don't.

Now the common argument is that you are "gaining value" for something that you normally would have had to pay retail for; so those "unexpended monies" should be included as part of your cash-winnings, or at least credited than way on the positive side of your Win/Loss ledger.

But here's the thing.

Would you have actually ordered that $250 meal in the first place had you had to pay for it with your own cash?

I can see the "Well, ya gotta eat!" argument; but that begs the question of whether or not you would have eaten so sumptuously had you not been comped for it.

the same goes for your hotel room or suite. If you had to pay for it in full...WITHOUT ANY PROSPECT OF HAVING IT COMPED...would you have stayed and paid in that same class of room?

~On the other hand, I can understand where reimbursed airfare or gas-cost comps could be considered as part of your net-winnings (though I don't include them as such); but beyond that, I think it's hard to argue that you can 'count' $1000 worth of MMA-fight tickets as a net-gain win if you wouldn't have otherwise attended if it were not for the comp.



MP

[heavy]

I do count comps as part of my overall win - athough I keep a separate side track of cash winnings only. As for the value I place on the comps - it's typically about 25% of what the casino values the comp at. Example - a $100 steak dinner is worth about $25 to me. That's about what I'd pay at a chain joint like Outback. But again, it's important to know where you really stand in the game.

[bounce the bones]

I eat what i normally eat if they pay for it that is money not coming out of my pocket.

Now lets get to it If i play a game that has no house edege the only thing i give up is the rake 5% on wins sounds like poker to me, but i get rated for comps like it is a table game, to me i come out way ahead.

2 hours at 300 per hand breaks down to rf&b at alot of places so that is a 100 to 300 a day that you do not spend.

That covers atot of airfare,gas true.

Who wouldn't like to sit at a poker table and be rated at 300 per hand for the time you were their and get the comps for it?

[bounce the bones]

the five count is very simple.

the shooter gets the dice makes five throws if the fifth throw is a craps number it doesn't count so you waite till the fifth throw is a box number, if he doesn't seven out durng that time you make a come bet at this point and only one.

"The purpose of this is to avoid a large percentage of short rolls figuring that the seven should appear once every six rolls.

[bounce the bones]

That is so correct and i new not what i say.

[batipoker9]

Thanks for the link and the explanation $nakeeye$. How has using the 5 count been working out for you?

I see a lot of disagreement on this thread about the effectiveness of the 5 count. Do you also happen to know some other sources where I can read about criticisms of the 5 count? The link you gave before talked about 2 criticisms briefly, but do you know where I could find anything more in depth? Thanks.

[batipoker9]

Thanks again $nakeEye$, good luck this weekend. Let me know how it works out for you. I thought you had tried it out already. I'll try a google search for critics, but all I seem to find are pages that promote the method. Maybe it's just that good? I'll do some more digging and see what comes up!

[batipoker9]

Well, after a google search turned up very little, I looked carefully at the comments on the southern gaming website and found this link: http://fogofgambling.blogspot.com/2011/ ... ethod.html
It should be pretty interesting for anyone looking for both pros and cons.

[heavy]

Interesting article - and it pretty much sums up what we've said through most of the thread. In theory the Captain's Five Count is not that much different than Heavy's Wait Until an Inside Number Rolls Before Betting theory. Oh, odds are I'll be in the game more often than the five counters - but really that's about it. It's just a way to delay entry into the game and hopefully avoid a few seven outs.

[Dylanfreake]

Shooter57 and I used the 5-count:::::::::::

But we used it on the Darkside. After the 5-count , we would make a DC/DP (whichever was appropriate ). Shooter always said Scoblete was right about the 5 count but used it on the wrong side.

[SHOOTITALL]

MP wrote on this several years ago, so it is in his archives. However, his math said it was a loser. DF using it on the dark side is right on. Maybe MP will repost that article. sia

[bounce the bones]

But playing the darkside you are looking for short rolls the five count elimnates 57 % of those.

How is it good to be on somthing for less than half of its winners?

[Dylanfreake]

bounce the bones, it`s really six of one half a dozen of the other .

Play whichever way or whichever side you want to and "Dont Look Back."

Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose; you are just as likely to win as you are to lose on each roll of the dice.
, whether you 2 count, 5 count, 10 count , 25 count or no count. Craps is just getting in or getting out at the right time.

What determines the right time for me to get in? When I walk up to the table to play. This way , I never have to second guess myself for not -playing or playing.

What determines the right time for me to get out---if I hit my loss limit (4% of bankroll), my predetermined time to play is up , or it`s time to go home or go eat , according to my boss named Gail.

Everybody should have a plan and that plan can be just as crazy or even crazier than my plan. But just stick with your plan. Only you can determine your plan . I play the Darkside, because I can only take losing one bet per shooter and my personality does not require for me to have a lot of action on the table. That means ," I ain`t got no money " and probably have too much patience. But if it weren`t for patience and discipline , I wouldn`t be playing craps today.

Take the best advice from everyone and take how you like to play and develop your way of play. I always tried to play like everyone else and was miserable. I then started playing how I liked to play ,came up with some recycled strategies (like Heavy alluded to in another post), gave them funny names and I have a great time playing craps.

Bob Dylan on one of his early album covers said, "The great books have been written and the great songs have been sung."

[acpa]

The Dice Doctor had a qualifying approach to a shooter also.

Noah

[wild child]

.
Ask: "How many have seen shooters hit every number ONCE( no repeaters then ( 7 ) SEVEN OUT?"

Even more frustrating is to see one number repeat twice and a seven out with the Pass Line not repeated and be on the Pass Line to see this repeated by several shooters in a series of hands.

W C