Genius2MaxOdds Strategy

[CrapsGenius]

I use my own "Genius2MaxOdds" Strategy. This strategy works well for me and may not work for others.

Table position > Spot 12 (far end of the table) or Spot 7 (right side of stick man).
Dice set used > all 7's on come out (changed for certain numbers), 4/6 top w/5's facing me for numbers (Repeating 6's, 9's, 10's).

Betting is as follows for a $5.00 3x4x5x table:
On Comeout,
1) $5/Firebet
2) $5/Passline
3) $5/Field
4) $2/Any Crap

When point is established,
4) Max Odds behind the passline bet.
5) $15 on 4/5/9/10, & $18 on 6/8 ($0 on the shooters point)
6) $5/Come (Every roll after comeout)
7) $5/Field (Every roll after comeout)
8) Come goes to (Number rolled) place bets "down w/max odds"

On new comeout after point is made
9) "Odds always working on comeout"
10) $10-$25/any seven (Hedge for comebet odds)

Again, this works for me and my shooting style and may not work for others.

For those "WinCraps" users, I have written a "Genius2MaxOdds" file and ran many simulations adjusting the probabilities section to cater to a more "real table feel"

Achieved many positive results with this style of play running simulations of "Per session 35 rolls", "Per session 350 rolls", "Per session 2100 rolls", "Per session 10,000 rolls" and also "Per session Hyper drive 100,000 rolls" Win/Loss average = to 45/55

[Mad Professor]

For those "WinCraps" users, I have written a "Genius2MaxOdds" file and ran many simulations adjusting the probabilities section to cater to a more "real table feel"

Hi CG,

Are we talking about betting on random-rollers here or are we talking about betting on your own influenced tosses?

If we are talking about random-betting, I would be curious to know what kind of 'adjustments' you made in order to give those random outcomes a more "real table feel".

Thanks,

MP

[CrapsGenius]

For those "WinCraps" users, I have written a "Genius2MaxOdds" file and ran many simulations adjusting the probabilities section to cater to a more "real table feel"

Hi CG,

Are we talking about betting on random-rollers here or are we talking about betting on your own influenced tosses?

If we are talking about random-betting, I would be curious to know what kind of 'adjustments' you made in order to give those random outcomes a more "real table feel".

Thanks,

MP

2>2.000
3>4.000
4>10.000
5>12.000
6>15.000
7>14.000
8>15.000
9>12.000
10>10.000
11>4.000
12>2.000

sometimes I adjust the 7 to more than 17.000 to test systems to see if they hold water showing a negative expectation by calculating the average loss as compared to average wins from previous sessions.

As per your shooting style, you will know what your own adjustments are when you run simulations that look more realistic to your type of rolling by running short 20 roll simulations.

[Mad Professor]

Hi CG,

Again, are we talking about betting on random outcomes, or those produced by skilled dice-influencers?

For example, your adjustments to WinCraps to reflect "real table feel"; are they based on betting on random-rollers or skilled DI's?

You seem to be indicating that it is on skilled-shooters; but your prior comments seem to indicate co-mingled random-based betting at the same time on those same 'adjusted' toss-stats.

Just looking for clarity.

Thanks,

MP

[CrapsGenius]

Skilled shooters is where its at. Random shooters 7 out way to fast and ruin the game. This morning was a very good day for dark side shooters other than the shooter who rolled a five number firebet, many other shooters 7'd out after point established. this went on for at least 2 hrs of bad shooters.

[dblayout]

Did you win on the Firebet?

[CrapsGenius]

Did you win on the Firebet?

The 5 number rolled on Feb 12, I got there shortly after but a couple regulars Rocko and Terry both had $5.00 on it and made good also on the numbers rolled.

I got there just shortly after and missed that one but did hedge against a couple 4 number ones that day.

I did hit the 4 number and 5 number a few days before on Feb 2nd. There has been a few more rolled since then that I did have the opportunity to hedge on making a few bucks.

So many to keep track of.

I don't hit many 4, 5 6 number firebets often but I do get the opportunity to hedge many 4th point to the fire on a regular basis during many visits.

[London Shooter]

"many other shooters 7'd out after point established. this went on for at least 2 hrs of bad shooters"

CrapsGenius, perhaps you could add a bit of balance to this whole firebet hedging debate by telling us how many $5 bets you lost during the above period?

[CrapsGenius]

"many other shooters 7'd out after point established. this went on for at least 2 hrs of bad shooters"

CrapsGenius, perhaps you could add a bit of balance to this whole firebet hedging debate by telling us how many $5 bets you lost during the above period?

Wow! I just answered this question in another forum.
1) between Feb 2nd to Feb 12 I've lost $100.00 (20 firebets) x 4 times approx total firebets lost over 10 days is probably $600 over the 10 days. This is just firebets not counting my wins/loses on place bets when I'm shooting.

I've lost more than 2000x $5.00 firebets over the last 3 months, but have won on hedging many against the 4th, 5th points for $100 to $500 at least 100 times. Far to many to keep track. but I've won 5k 2 times on 6 number fire and 5 number 5 times (This was before hedging)

long story short, I'm still up on just firebets not counting what I make from placebets.

[heavy]

It would be interesting to hear about your TOTAL play - not just Fire Bet wins. Total action in - total cash out. Up or down?

[gargoil]

I've lost more than 2000x $5.00 firebets over the last 3 months, but have won on hedging many against the 4th, 5th points for $100 to $500 at least 100 times. Far to many to keep track. but I've won 5k 2 times on 6 number fire and 5 number 5 times (This was before hedging)

long story short, I'm still up on just firebets not counting what I make from placebets.

So let me see if I got the math right.
Over the last 3 months (you didn't specify how many times you went to the casino and played but ....) you have
1- lost $10000.00 on fire bets
2- Won anywhere between $10000.00 to $50000.00 on fire bets
3- have seen fire bets hit at least 100 times ( that's roughly 33 times a month)
4- If you played every day that's around every trip to the casino)

I call Bull shit. Others on the forum can feel free to chime in and respond to your posts but I won't anymore. I get enough Bull shit from my wife.

[LeftyAJ]

I've lost more than 2000x $5.00 firebets over the last 3 months, but have won on hedging many against the 4th, 5th points for $100 to $500 at least 100 times. Far to many to keep track. but I've won 5k 2 times on 6 number fire and 5 number 5 times (This was before hedging)

long story short, I'm still up on just firebets not counting what I make from placebets.

So let me see if I got the math right.
Over the last 3 months (you didn't specify how many times you went to the casino and played but ....) you have
1- lost $10000.00 on fire bets
2- Won anywhere between $10000.00 to $50000.00 on fire bets
3- have seen fire bets hit at least 100 times ( that's roughly 33 times a month)
4- If you played every day that's around every trip to the casino)

I call Bull shit. Others on the forum can feel free to chime in and respond to your posts but I won't anymore. I get enough Bull shit from my wife.

Troll_bada57_1377162[1].jpg (21.15 KiB) Viewed 17151 times

[CrapsGenius]

I've lost more than 2000x $5.00 firebets over the last 3 months, but have won on hedging many against the 4th, 5th points for $100 to $500 at least 100 times. Far to many to keep track. but I've won 5k 2 times on 6 number fire and 5 number 5 times (This was before hedging)

long story short, I'm still up on just firebets not counting what I make from placebets.

So let me see if I got the math right.
Over the last 3 months (you didn't specify how many times you went to the casino and played but ....) you have
1- lost $10000.00 on fire bets
2- Won anywhere between $10000.00 to $50000.00 on fire bets
3- have seen fire bets hit at least 100 times ( that's roughly 33 times a month)
4- If you played every day that's around every trip to the casino)

I call Bull shit. Others on the forum can feel free to chime in and respond to your posts but I won't anymore. I get enough Bull shit from my wife.

Hey, Back up a bit. First off I have a job and don't get to play everyday,
1) my visits are only approx 2-5hrs maybe 3 times per week.
2) I take an average $100.00 for firebets and 400 for when I play Place/come/down w/max odds. (Approx $1500/week)
3) I keep an extra bankroll aside for firebet hedging to cover $120 on 4th point, $600-750 on 5th point and 2k when hedging against the 6th point.
4) 4th point hedging is approx 3 times per visit (3 x 3visits per week = 9 4th number hedging = to a minimum total of 900/week that\s 3600 per month. but some days there are more than just 3, there are more like 8-9 4th point hedging opportunities.
5) I'd say an average of 2x 5th number firebet hedges at 500 each . I do miss quite a few because of what the other regulars and dealers tell me when I show up, how many were made since last.

in the last 3 months I only made about 16k in firebet winnings that's why I promote it so much, its a great bet.

6) when I shoot the dice I start with 5-10/passline w/full odds + 81 across, depending on number, 5-10/field, 5-10/come w/max odds on all numbers as they come in down place bets. total I invest approx 130 per session and many times will average between 150-350 per average rolling session and rake in close to 2k during my hot roll sessions when rolling repeating numbers. (25rolls per session)

yes in the 3 months I over stay some visits in hopes to catch some firebet opportunities, sometimes I go beyond the 20 rolls
and risk close to 100x $5.00 firebets just in an 8 hr session. (That's my thrill and addiction)

7) craps is very time crazy and its hard to notice what your winning/risking during those times. can't accurately keep track of the other bets I make. I'm not an accountant.

I don't want to give you an impression of over-exaggeration, I'm just stating some facts so far in my play.

[CrapsGenius]

It would be interesting to hear about your TOTAL play - not just Fire Bet wins. Total action in - total cash out. Up or down?

Its hard to show an accurate number at this time because I do hit many Point seven outs too. It's craps, we all have many losing sessions too along with winning sessions. I do go home a few times with 2k but a few nights I lose 200-300 from my bank roll. I do however hit very good when the good is going good raking in close to 3k-4k utilizing the Maxbet strategy.

Face it, craps is all about system players, no one changes their betting styles for years, we all play our own way and refuse change.

[London Shooter]

CG I just don't see how your figures add up. Leaving the firebet for now you also say you take $400 for a session yet are passlining with full odds and 81 across and then doing your come bets also with full odds. Surely two or three early 7s and your session bankroll is completely gone?

[heavy]

Its hard to show an accurate number at this time because I do hit many Point seven outs too.

No, you simply jot down the difference in what you took TO the casino and what you took FROM the casino.

Let's say you take $400 to the casino today and play every day for one month. At the end of the month that $400 has grown to $2400. You won $2000. But if you lose that $400 and "rebuy" with additional funds to the point that you have added $3000 to that $400 and you end the month up with $2400 - you lost $1000.

You should have a SEPARATE casino bankroll. You add winnings to that bankroll throughout the month and deduct losses from it. This is your working capital. You don't spend it. You simply watch it grow (or disappear). What you end up with minus what you started with is your monthly win or loss.

[CrapsGenius]

Its hard to show an accurate number at this time because I do hit many Point seven outs too.

No, you simply jot down the difference in what you took TO the casino and what you took FROM the casino.

Let's say you take $400 to the casino today and play every day for one month. At the end of the month that $400 has grown to $2400. You won $2000. But if you lose that $400 and "rebuy" with additional funds to the point that you have added $3000 to that $400 and you end the month up with $2400 - you lost $1000.

You should have a SEPARATE casino bankroll. You add winnings to that bankroll throughout the month and deduct losses from it. This is your working capital. You don't spend it. You simply watch it grow (or disappear). What you end up with minus what you started with is your monthly win or loss.

the more realistic approach is to record what you leave the casino with. I just got back from there just a few minutes ago. I went for breakfast then bought in around 10am with 100.00 played firebet all day. Hedged 3 firebets for 120 each at 4th point and won all of them throughout the day. bankroll stayed close to 300 throughout the day. Just around 6:30 I hit a 4point firebet for 125, but lost because point was made. Opportunity may have been there for a cool 750.00 hedge but the shooter repeated 8, 3 times and sevened out, so I had no opportunity to hedge 5th point. All in all I hit a few point -7 outs and left the casino with empty pockets.

In reality I made more than 300 in profits from firebet hedging, but the latter part of the story is I left donating my $100.00.

No 5 or 6 numbers firebets were made today. todays average was 3 firebet hedges in 9 straight hrs of play.

[gargoil]

[SoSerious]

CG I just don't see how your figures add up. Leaving the firebet for now you also say you take $400 for a session yet are passlining with full odds and 81 across and then doing your come bets also with full odds. Surely two or three early 7s and your session bankroll is completely gone?

Yes, with only $400 and betting $5 passline max odds and then come bet with max odds there is no way you can stay in the game with that small amount of a bankroll.

[London Shooter]

Well he can manage 9 hours of $5 firebetting with just $100......

Maybe we all need to go to this casino?