Beating the California Craps game

[heavy]

Thanks Pointman. I've never seen the version of the game where a dice throw determines which card is selected. Only the one where the cards are shuffled, then put into stacks and dealt for the decision. I find the whole concept very intriguing. Anyone want to take a crack at the math behind all this? Frankly, I'm pretty much stumped.

[Alohajonny]

I live 20 minutes from a casino that plays this six-card version and work 15 minutes from another casino that also has this game. I still haven't played a penny at either table. When they first started this without the Shufflemasters they would mix the cards up by hand every once in awhile. Nowadays they leave them up as long as you want at one of the casinos. If you can throw hardways the only thing that changes is which hardway will be your outcome...

If you throw a hard eight for example they refer to the card in the fourth square and call it a hard ___.

I still won't spend my money in there (except for the buffets). I just don't like my state allowing "Sovereign Nations" to have gaming and not let the citizens/taxpayers to have it. Imagine the tourism dollars coming in. Take your kids to the Sea World Hotel & Casino... CHA CHING BAHDAH BING! Next day Disneyland Hotel & Casino then on to Legoland Hotel & Casino... next stop, the beach!

Sorry, I got a little carried away there. I'm glad I could backspace over my last ranting paragraph. (You folks have NO IDEA how many times I do that.)

Thank you POINTMAN for the encouragement to play craps in CA. I hope someday to meet up with you. If you play at any of the San Diego or Temecula casinos I'd love to join you.

[Mad Professor]

If I recall correctly, the now-deceased board-member "W7" wrote extensively about beating that specific game for several months in a row, until he had a bad encounter with a ne' er do well out in the parking lot.

Apparently a bad guy brandished a gun, then Jim brandished a much bigger gun, so both of them decided to go separate ways. That write-up might have only appeared on John Patrick's board, and not been cross-posted here.

In any case, wwwwwww insisted that that specific game was reliably beatable.


MP

[acpa]

The only casinos with Calif craps I've played with dealt out six cards in two separate group and turned two cards up based on the dice throw.

Therefore the game was Ramon.

Noah

[London Shooter]

Pointman - thanks for posting this interesting analysis. First time I read it, I couldn't make sense of how an advantage could be had but now I see the point as I assume the 6 cards dealt by the dealer are face up so you know what your on axis 7 will produce from the cards, yes?

[Mad Professor]

Hi Pointman,

When I mentioned our departed member, W7, using a similar approach; I wasn't trying to apportion credit, but rather simply point out that the two of you found a similar way to beat California Craps.

I like the fact that you chose to share an advantage-play angle with fellow board-members, and I'm sure a number of them will follow-up on it.

No ill intent on my part; simply confirming an observation. Thanks again for sharing too.


MP

[Alohajonny]

Down here in the San Diego region we have a few casinos that don't use shufflemasters to mix up cards with pictures of dice outcomes. (yes, pictures of two dice on each card).

They use six standard playing cards... an ace, two, three, four, five, and a six. In front of the box person there are six rectangular outlines. The box lays out the cards and mixes them around in a swirling motion, then lays each card face up in an outlined position. Each box is numbered so that when the dice are rolled the call will be whatever is in the box that corresponds to each dice face.


card1=5.......card2=3.......card3=6.......card4=1.......card5=2.......card6=4

So if these were the cards laid out and you rolled a one and a two (don't say it - I know you did, how can you not?). Anyway, so now you refer to the first and second box... The call would be eight.
So, if you rolled a six and a six.... Hard eight would be the call.

I hope this helps.

With this combination throwing sevens would net you:
6,1 or 1,6= 9
5,2 or 2,5= 5
4,3 or 3,4= 7

Barona, Sycuan, and (I think) Viejas has this game in our neck of the woods.

[freak]

So do they switch up the cards for each roll or just once per shooter?

[Alohajonny]

I'm not sure of exactly when the boxperson is supposed to mix them up. It looked like they would shuffle with each new shooter at one of the places. I did ask one time while I was watching at another place and the box lady told me she would shuffle only if you asked. I'll find out the next time I'm in.