My Current Charting and Press Moves . . .

[heavy]

I'll take these one set of sisters at a time. For example, betting the Six and Eight, the Five and Nine, and the Four and Ten.

Six and Eight Press Moves

Let me preface this by saying that on MOST hands you'll do much better over the long run to take a couple of hits and down. However, you'll never score one of those four or five figure wins doing that, so lelt's go:

I bet the inside numbers for $15 each - or $66 inside. I bet the four and ten for $25 each right off the bat. However, I don't bet all the numbers on every shooter. I will start every shooter off with $18 each on the Six and Eight. Any other bets made are a result of charting current trends - or are based on observation of the shooter's ability and results on a previous round. So let's start with the Six and eight at $18each - $36 total Investment.

First hit on either number - I collect $21 and "same bet" it.
Second hit on either number - I drop $3 on top of the $21 pay off and tell the dealer to press me to $42.
Third hit on my pressed bet - Collect $50 for $1 ($49 net)
Fourth hit on the pressed bet - Power Press to $90.

I should note here that if the sister number hits during all of the above we just "same bet" it. We want most of our action on the number that's showing up the most often, so if we've been pressing the Six and the Eight suddenly takes off we can move the bets around and put the larger sum on the number that's hitting.

Fifth hit on my pressed bet pays $105. I like to collect $100 and tip the dealer $5.
Sixth hit Press to $180 - Press to $180 and collect $20. Toss another red chip to the dealers if you want to keep the positive Juju going.
Seventh hit pays $210 - Same bet. Now you're getting black chips.
Eighth hit - drop $30 and power press to $420. Now you've got the pit's attention.
Ninth hit - $500 for $10. And yes, I toss another $5 to the dealers.
Tenth hit - Press to $900. You'll get $10 change.
Eleventh hit - - pays $1050. Collect $1025 and drop the dealers a quarter.
Twelfth hit - Pays $1050 - Press to $1800 and lock up $150.
Thirteenth hit - Collect $2100.
Thirteenth hit - Drop $300 and press to $4200.
Fourteenth hit - pays $5000 for $100.
Last of all - if you're not at table max then the next hit pays $5000 for $100 - go ahead and press ti $9000. If you get that far - miracles can happen.

Now let's look at the five and nine. Let's say you have $15 each on the five and nine.
First hit pays $21 - Same bet.
Second hit pays $21 - Press the number that hit to $35.
Third hit (on $35 pressed) pays $50 for $1 - Same Bet.
Fourth hit pays $50 for $1 - press to $75 and lock up the $9 change.
Fifth hit pays $105 - Same bet - lock up $100 - toke the dealers $5.
Sixth hit pays $105 - Press to $150 - lock up the $35 change.
Seventh hit pays $210 - Same bet.
Eighth hit pays $210 - Press to $350 and lock up $10 change.
The rest of the progression just repeats what we've done so far - but you add a zero to the base numbers. Again, only press the dominant number. Let the sister pay the bills for you to roll around.

Last of all is the Four and Ten. I'll just run through the progression. Same rules apply about only pressing the dominant number.

$25 - $50 - $100 - $250 - $500 - $1000 - $2500 - $5000 - $7500, etc.

You don't get those lightning strikes often, but when they come it makes for a hell of a trip reports.

[Cap-n_Lou]

Thanks for the formula ... Looking forward to the chance to try it. At least for a few hits. My challenge is keeping straight which numbers are hitting. Normally I use chips in my rack but that doesn't always work as I get distracted.

[220Inside]

This is a great summary Heavy. I learned this from you in Biloxi earlier this year and it's made a difference in my session results.

Couple of quick questions

- For the second hit, when you say "Second hit on either number", are you referring to the second hit on the same number (say the second 6) or truly the second hit on either number (i.e. First hit on 6, second hit on 8) when you power press? I think it's the former and that's how I've been betting it. Basically press progressions tracking the hits on each number separately.

- If you're not laying across, at which point do you start branching out to more sister numbers?

- If you're on the PL, either for yourself or another shooter, what do you do when a come out number moves to one of the place bets you have started a progression on and how does this affect any odds you would place?

[heavy]

I press the second number in the pair to hit. So if I had an $18 six and eight and the six hit - paying me $21 - then the eight hit - paying another $21 I would press the last number that hit - the eight in this case. I press every other hit on the number that just got pressed. I don't press the six unless it becomes a dominant number. I just collect $21 every time it hits. This helps you early on in the series by forcing you to take more money off the table rather than pressing every number on the table.

The decision to place the four and ten is easy. If they appear more times in six rolls than statistics say they should then I bet both. I'll let you do the math to figure the formula out. The answer is - twice in six rolls. I always bet the four and ten in pairs - if I bet one I bet the other. I only press one of these numbers as well, but I press from the very FIRST hit. Here's the press sequence:

25 - 50 - 100 - 250 - 500 - 1000 - 2500 - 5000 - 10000

Odds are you're at table max already at $5000, but in Vegas you'll find some tables with a $10,000 max bet.

Regarding the five and nine - my preference is to handle these individually when making a decision on betting them - in large part because of the higher vig on these numbers. Let's just look at the nine. There are four ways to roll a nine out of thirty-six combinations of the dice. 6-3, 3-6, 5-4, and 4-5. That's one nine every nine rolls of the dice. If you don't understand the math behind that then you need a little Odds 101 help. If I have time I'll put together an article on that topic and post it on the "New to the Game" sub-board in the next few days. Anyway, if the nine is rolling more frequently than once in every nine tosses then I'll consider placing it. Same with the five.

I like tracking a very short (rolling) series to determine what's hot. That series is nine rolls, giving me a current look at whether the five and nine are dominant - along with the other numbers. You track a rolling series of the last nine decisions. Let me throw some numbers at you. Let's look at nine rolls:

6 - 9 - 11 - 12- 4 - 10 - 4 - 9 - 2

Okay, I would have started out with the six and eight. It's not until the ten rolls that I make my next bet - the four and ten for $25 each. That's because they've rolled twice in the last six rolls. On the seventh toss the four rolls again and I immediately press the four to $50. Then the nine rolls again. That's two nines in eight rolls so I bet the nine for $15. Then the two craps rolls. I note that a Horn number has rolled after each of the two nines tossed. Horn numbers are rolling at roughly double the expected rate. I won't bet it yet, but I'll look at what comes after the next nine and include that in my analysis. That's my series of nine rolls.

The shooter tosses the dice again and throws an eight. I drop off the first six and start my new series with that first nine. The tracking now looks like this.

9 - 11 - 12- 4 - 10 - 4 - 9 - 2 - 8

The eight paid $21. I've already been paid once on the sister, so I drop $3 on top of the pay off and press the eight to $42. The next toss is another nine. This is the first hit on the nine since I placed it, so I collect $21 and same bet it. The dice roll again and the eleven shows. The first nine drops off the front of my chart and the eleven takes up the rear. This is the third time a Horn number has rolled following a nine. Math guys be damned - it's "see a nine - bet the Horn" time. Now the series looks like this:

12- 4 - 10 - 4 - 9 - 2 - 8 - 9 - 11

That should give you an idea of what I'm talking about. While I'm paying close attention to the last nine numbers that rolled, it's also important to look at the current shooter's results as a whole, so don't disregard that. Sunday morning we were playing a session in Vegas when we noted that every time the nine showed it was followed by the seven. Freaky coincidence? Maybe so. But I sure saved a lot of money having my bets turned off after the nine rolled.

I revised this post a bit to clean up a couple of spots where I worded things poorly. Hopefully all of that helps somewhat. Even after playing this crazy game for over 40 years it's still a work in progress.

[220Inside]

Awesome stuff, Heavy. Thanks!

[hotshooter]

Heavy,
Do you take the dealers directly on the powe presses or do you toke them say $5 toward the hardways?

Do you use this progression on chicken feeders that get hot?

[Moe Bettor]

This is what I needed. Thanks

[rhythm roller]

Considering looking at the last nine rolls, do you start over with a new nine on a new shooter or just keep the sequence going even if the shooter changes? Thanks!

[heavy]

I keep the last nine in mind as we move on to the next shooter, but I start tracking and betting back at ground zero. Is I happened to be "off" when the last shooter sevened out I'd take everything down and make the six and eight look like $18 each - then move on from there.

[hotshooter]

PostThu Jul 21, 2016 10:23 am

Heavy,
Do you take the dealers directly on the power presses or do you toke them say $5 toward the hardways?

Do you use this progression on chicken feeders that get hot?

[wiremonkey]

Heavy quick question, on the original thread at the top, the 5 and 9 press schedule you did, am i wrong in seeing that a step is missing after you same bet the 35 dollar bet. " 4th hit pays 70, same bet "

[heavy]

Good catch, wiremonkey. I went back and corrected it. The progression is 15 - 35 - 75 - 150 - 350 - 750 - 1500 - 3500 - 7500 . . . etc. I have no idea what I was smoking when I said press to $70. Probably posting while sleeping again.

Hotshooter - I typically tip with a line bet or hardway bet at every stick change, but when I'm power pressing and get to the point that I'm collecting more than $100 on a hit I'll toss in a $5 hand in - sometimes every hit - sometimes every other. Depends on the level of service (which improves greatly when you start tossing in red and green chips as tokes). I'll also toss in my loose $1 chips at the end of a session. I usually set them up as place bets for the dealers - say $4 inside.

[heavy]

The first post in this thread covers most of my current press moves on the six and eight, five and nine, and four and ten. We had a request from one of the board members today for links to threads where we discussed how we handle pressing on the various sister numbers. Feel free to start at the top of this thread and read it through. If you have any thoughts or questions after feel free to post them. We'll do our best to answer.

[Big O]

Heavy. not sure when i first memorized the press schedule above. I think it was after reading a hand out you gave me or from an email you sent me. I wish i would have known it when i first started playing. I havent had a chance to use it much the last couple of trips, but when its working its a great ride. "Sir you are at table max on the 10". Hearing that is one of my craps goals.

[mainframe]

Heavy: Thanks so much for posting this! I dont have time to read the entire thread right now (just read your initial post), but I intend to print this out and keep it on a reference card I can bring to the table when I have time to try out this betting strategy

[heavy]

Just make sure you adjust your bet size to match your bankroll and buy-in. Over-betting your bankroll is never a good thing.

[London Shooter]

I'll second that. H's press moves detailed above are by his own admission aggressive and won't suit everybody.

[Parson]

I'll take these one set of sisters at a time. For example, betting the Six and Eight, the Five and Nine, and the Four and Ten.

Six and Eight Press Moves

Let me preface this by saying that on MOST hands you'll do much better over the long run to take a couple of hits and down. However, you'll never score one of those four or five figure wins doing that, so lelt's go:

I bet the inside numbers for $15 each - or $66 inside. I bet the four and ten for $25 each right off the bat. However, I don't bet all the numbers on every shooter. I will start every shooter off with $18 each on the Six and Eight. Any other bets made are a result of charting current trends - or are based on observation of the shooter's ability and results on a previous round. So let's start with the Six and eight at $18each - $36 total Investment.

First hit on either number - I collect $21 and "same bet" it.
Second hit on either number - I drop $3 on top of the $21 pay off and tell the dealer to press me to $42.
Third hit on my pressed bet - Collect $50 for $1 ($49 net)
Fourth hit on the pressed bet - Power Press to $90.

I should note here that if the sister number hits during all of the above we just "same bet" it. We want most of our action on the number that's showing up the most often, so if we've been pressing the Six and the Eight suddenly takes off we can move the bets around and put the larger sum on the number that's hitting.

Fifth hit on my pressed bet pays $105. I like to collect $100 and tip the dealer $5.
Sixth hit Press to $180 - Press to $180 and collect $20. Toss another red chip to the dealers if you want to keep the positive Juju going.
Seventh hit pays $210 - Same bet. Now you're getting black chips.
Eighth hit - drop $30 and power press to $420. Now you've got the pit's attention.
Ninth hit - $500 for $10. And yes, I toss another $5 to the dealers.
Tenth hit - Press to $900. You'll get $10 change.
Eleventh hit - - pays $1050. Collect $1025 and drop the dealers a quarter.
Twelfth hit - Pays $1050 - Press to $1800 and lock up $150.
Thirteenth hit - Collect $2100.
Thirteenth hit - Drop $300 and press to $4200.
Fourteenth hit - pays $5000 for $100.
Last of all - if you're not at table max then the next hit pays $5000 for $100 - go ahead and press ti $9000. If you get that far - miracles can happen.

Now let's look at the five and nine. Let's say you have $15 each on the five and nine.
First hit pays $21 - Same bet.
Second hit pays $21 - Press the number that hit to $35.
Third hit (on $35 pressed) pays $50 for $1 - Same Bet.
Fourth hit pays $50 for $1 - press to $75 and lock up the $9 change.
Fifth hit pays $105 - Same bet - lock up $100 - toke the dealers $5.
Sixth hit pays $105 - Press to $150 - lock up the $35 change.
Seventh hit pays $210 - Same bet.
Eighth hit pays $210 - Press to $350 and lock up $10 change.
The rest of the progression just repeats what we've done so far - but you add a zero to the base numbers. Again, only press the dominant number. Let the sister pay the bills for you to roll around.

Last of all is the Four and Ten. I'll just run through the progression. Same rules apply about only pressing the dominant number.

$25 - $50 - $100 - $250 - $500 - $1000 - $2500 - $5000 - $7500, etc.

You don't get those lightning strikes often, but when they come it makes for a hell of a trip reports.

Im bumping this, as I missed a step ore two last night in practice. I had 6 hits on the 4 in the hand - but had $2000 on it after the 6th hit ... missed taking some to the rack somewhere.

I had $600 on the 6 - lotta hits on it as well - mis stepped on that one as well