Rule of Thumb:Ratio of Dedicated Bank Roll to Buy In to Minimum/Maxium Wager Risk .Do You Have One?

[wild child]

One old standard

Only play table games with a Dedicated Bank Roll.

The suggested Ratio

Dedicated Bank Roll minimum $ US Dollar Value
At least Five Times the Buy-In Dollar Amount

Buy In suggested 30 times the Table Minimum Limit $ US Dollar Value

Initial Bet 1/30 of the Buy-In...

Applying that OLD SCHOOL Guide Line:

A Ten Dollar Minimum ( $10.00 )
would suggest a Buy-In of $300 as a Minimum Dollar Value.

Thus the suggested bankroll of at least $1500
as a minimum to cover an EARLY DRAWDOWN in a session.

With that caution Tables with
Minimums of $25 or $50 or $100
would suggest adjusting the

Dedicated Casino Bank-Roll, Buy-In, and that specific Table Minimum...

Seasoned mature Old Hand Table Game Gamblers
may pontificate that LARGER SUGGESTIONED DOLLAR Risk Money of LARGER AMOUNTS.

Do you enter the Casino Arena with an adequate amount of
Risk of Loss money?

Would you suggest an amount smaller or larger?

Would also establish a "Loss Limit" or even a Win Limit"
beyond your Comfort Limit?

Suggestions?

Wild Child

[House of Orange]

Thinking $1500 buy in at $25 table. Comments?

[wild child]

Thinking $1500 buy-in at $25 table. Comments?

H oO
Good Catch $750 -$800 may better fit
a more conservative Buy-In
in that Table Minimum example...

w c

[heavy]

Based on early trip reports from players in my FB group it looks like $15 - $25 minimums on weekends are the norm now, with some casinos running $25 - $50 minimums. Horseshoe in Tunica, for example, was running $25 minimums on both of their Crapless games over the weekend and $15 - $25 minimums on their regular games. Mid-week limits seem to be less - $10 - $15 depending on demand. So there you go.

As for session bankroll - that should depend on your trip bankroll and your lifetime bankroll. I've given formulas in the past for determining your lifetime bankroll but I'll toss out a simple version. Your lifetime bankroll is the amount you'd have to lose before you'd say "screw it, I'm never playing this game again as long as I live." So let's say you can afford to lose $400 a month but if you lose $410 you're done. $400 a month is your monthly bankroll. Now multiply that times the number of months of life expectancy you have left. Average male in the US - somewhere around 80 years. If you're 50 that's 30 more years - times 12 = 360 months - times $400 = $14,400. That's your lifetime bankroll. ALL of your betting decisions should be based on a percentage of your lifetime bankroll. You should bet a percentage of your lifetime bankroll based on your PROVEN advantage over the game. Note that you ONLY have an advantage over the game when YOU are the shooter. So calculate your edge and only bet when you are the shooter. If you have a 1.1% edge over the game then your average bet should be what? $158. This is a simplified Kelly calculation. Throughout your session you will bet 1.1% of whatever amount you have in the rack at the beginning of each hand. In this case, though, you'll start out with $25 on the Pass Line. Go ahead and take $50 odds. That leaves you $83 to Place Bet. We'll fudge a buck and take $42 each on the Six and Eight, assuming neither of them is the point. Otherwise, take the one that isn't the point and your dominant number. Then just toss the dice and "same bet" it until the cows come home. Again, next time you get the dice you'll adjust the size of your wager based on 1.1% of what you have in the rack - assuming 1.1% is your documented positive EV at the game.

As for Buy In? I typically recommend 12 times your average bet. In this case that works out to $1896. I'd probably buy in for $2000 just to make it easy on the box and dealers and to bump up my buy-in for ratings purposes.

There is no "set" buy in that works for everyone on any specific dollar limit table. Everyone is different based on their advantage, betting strategy, etc. Do the hard work and figure it out.

[Big O]

was running $25 minimums on both of their Crapless games over the weekend and $15 - $25 minimums on their regular games.

i have run into higher minimums on crapless in the past. Is there a reason for that? Since there are more numbers to cover it requires more at risk to bet across which makes the higher limit even more of an issue.

[wild child]

was running $25 minimums on both of their Crapless games over the weekend and $15 - $25 minimums on their regular games.

I have run into higher minimums on crapless in the past. Is there a reason for that? Since there are more numbers to cover it requires more at risk to bet across which makes the higher limit even more of an issue.

After removing the stronger
( by a slim percentage )
DARK Side Dice GAME

the House considers treating the numbers Two, Three, Eleven & Twelve as
another BOX Number
and
paying 3 times odds on 3 and Yo
and
Six Times ODDS on the TWO & Twelve and generally using LONG TABLE furniture
the HOUSE wants to increase THE $ HOLD on that table. ( all the HORN Numbers)

The HOUSE attitude remains " It is ALL about THE MONEY "

just me saying
w c

[Tgold]

Hi wild child. Great thread and imo one of the most important topics(and often overlooked).

My general answer to your very important thread: "It Depends".

The most important question(s) are: A)what is ones goal? B)Does one have a verified advantage greater than the casinos edge? What is SD/Variance for ones chosen game/wager...etc.

Players goal should dictate ones buyin to wager ratio: Bankroll/Buyin growth, to endure and make buyin survive several thousand decisions, earn greater comps, only visit cas to have a lot of fun/drink beer, will one wager one,two, three or more bets at same time in games like craps...etc.

Can the player tolerate losing the buyin? How often can the player tolerate losing buyin: 1 per 2 sessions, 1 per 5 sessions, 1 per 20 sessions, never?How will one replenish buyin or bankroll? From previous winnings, paycheck, other investments...etc.

It is critical that a player identifies a precise answer to (A) above: What is primary goal? in other words why am I playing this game/how will the wins be utilized: Other Investments, 100% to bankroll, 50/50 to bankroll/hobbies, pay bills,...etc?

Once one can answer (A) then I believe every single thing we do at the table should be governed with precision to reach that objective. Trust me the casino has calculated every single part of their game plan.


For example: Lets say one wants to play as long as possible on a $1000 buyin, has ten other buyin replacements in bankroll, and doesn't know if they have an advantage(or lack of), how much, and if advantage will show on demand, deems it important to seldom if ever bust buyin, and only wagers a single DC wager per shooter in craps, . ..etc.
My suggestion would be to make starting DC wager-to-buyin approx. .014--.02 of buyin. Flat bet initially and never press. Whatever starting %(say .015) and adjust that % to current buyin total(if BI=1000 then starting wager =$15, If now current BI total =1333.33 then wager=$20, if BI down to $700 then wager=$10, ...etc.).

For example: Lets say one wants to grow buyin, bankroll, and wager size, and is confident they have a verified advantage (.025) greater than HE. I would recommend starting with a wager-to-buyin ratio % of approx. (.025). So as in the example above I would suggest wagering $25 on a buyin of $1000, $50 on a BI=2000, ...etc. Pressing or not, how aggressive,, Flat, slow compound curve,...etc for another thread, though equally important.


We all have different goals, at different stages of life, different options for replenishing bankroll/buyin, casino trips 5x per week, 5 x per year...etc so that will ultimately be an individual decision.

IMO we will have more success at reaching our goals if we have a clear game plan that is matched (in sync) with
our Goals:
Bankroll-to-Buyin-to-Wager Size IMO is one of most important part of game plan for a casino investor. Second only to knowing if one has a verified advantage(or lack of), and how much. If one does indeed have an advantage, then all kinds of options for the above topics.

Good topic wild child.


Continued success to all,

[wild child]

When I posted this thread my thoughts were of those new to the game players.

The folks who may have found their way to Heavy's A P C site
in need of unlearning incorrect other than a sound introduction
to playing Casino Games with the intention of playing STRONG, loosing little
and
perhaps actually leaving A NET Winner.

You have responded with good advice and GAME STRATEGY
perhaps of interest to experienced as well as those new to THE CRAPS Pit.

just me saying
w c

PS: Way long ago
Heavy was kind enough to additionally provide information to
successfully play Games Other Than Craps
under " Games Other Than Craps"

Wishing one and all many REWARDING casino adventures.