Heavy's Axis Power Craps Forum

I'm feeling like I may be packing too much action when I go to Vegas. Typically, when heading to Sin City I'll take somewhere between three and five thousand cash, with about twice that amount available in credit at various properties - a ten to twelve k total bankroll availability, should I need it. I rarely do. Usually I buy in for around 10 - 15% of my cash bankroll. I maintain fairly rigid loss limits. I like to get in - get up - and get gone. I enjoy playing a lot of hit and run sessions - and perhaps one or two semi-marathon sessions if the table is running warm to hot OR stone cold. Yeah, I'll play the Don'ts. But the thing I wanted to ask YOU guys is how much YOU pack to Vegas for a weekender - say four days and three nights - and how you apportion it for your sessions.

According to a recent survey of Vegas visitors compiled by the Las Vegas Convention and Visitors Authority - Vegas visitors gaming budgets averaged $484.70. Personally, I can't imagine a weekend Vegas trip with just a $500 gaming bankroll. But we have had students show up to seminars with even less than that.

Here's a link to the USA Today article that talks about average bankroll. I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts - and how you handle your gaming budget in Vegas.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/experienc ... _262035148

Good timing on the thread.....

Heading to Vegas for a long weekend in November.

Three full days.

I like to mix it up as such: 65% Craps , 25% Sports, 10% Poker.

Typically 5 stacks will do the trick, and when I lose bad, I still have $2000 at the end of the trip....so equate that to a 60% LL.

$484 in Vegas?!?!?!

wow....must be boring as hell...

I'm a low roller for sure, I only play craps and I think $500 is low. I'll take $500 to cherokee with an understanding that I have an extra $500 if needed. I would double that for Vegas but my style of craps is low risk. I don't mind playing at a table for 8 hours as it has a lot to do with entertainment for me.

The $500 would work for me though. The last 2 times I went to cherokee I bought in with $200 each time and walked away with $1,300 total for the 2 trips. Now I also stood next to one guy who won 5k while I won $800 and another guy won 20k while I won $600. I couldn't think about losing 5k.

Excellent timing, indeed!

I'm sitting here contemplating my bankroll for the upcoming Tunica seminar - which I've conveniently parlayed into a business trip to Vegas. So I'm looking at Fri-Sun in Tunica followed by Sun-Thu in Vegas. I'm planning on taking $500 per session. Trouble is I'm trying to determine the number of sessions I'll be playing. I expect it'll be around 10 so I'm looking at $5k for a 6 day trip (flight out on Thursday morning).

For a general trip, I'll schedule two sessions per day and may add a third if the first two were good to me.

every year my company has a recognition event in Vegas during the end of November. Last year when I was there, still being a fairly new gambler, I brought $1000 which at the time was all I could afford to bring. Talking with some of the other people there, some had bankrolls as low as $40, several people brought $100 (and acted like it was a lot) but very few brought any more than that. Of course these were people there on a free trip not necessarily players who had to pay their way there.

I am hoping to have about $3,000 or so to bring this year with $300-$500 buy in per session. By far that will be the largest bankroll I've had on a trip. Unless I can make it to the boats before then, that were also be my first time attempting DI during live play.... I have a long way to go before I'm ready!

Dave73 wrote:I am hoping to have about $3,000 or so to bring this year with $300-$500 buy in per session. By far that will be the largest bankroll I've had on a trip. Unless I can make it to the boats before then, that were also be my first time attempting DI during live play.... I have a long way to go before I'm ready!

I remember the first time I did DI, I had practiced in my basement and had some toss's around 20. Got to cherokee and the new dice felt all wrong in my hands, I was sweaty and thought everyone was staring at me because I was setting the dice and taking too long. I had a 3 roll then seven'ed out. I used the 5 count on a bunch of RR's and got the dice a few more times and each time it felt better and better. I'm not a newbie to DI but I guess as long as I can still make money while playing craps, I can slowly learn to be a better DI.

My tentative goal is to get at least some time in for live play before November. Will most likely make a low budget trip to S/BC and play doey-dont just for practice, lose some of the edge, and to get a better comparison of a real table vs my practice table....something I never really paid attention to in the past.

My at home sessions are all over the place. Ill do good for a session then Ill have no consistency at all...

The age old question for every DI. How much do I bring to play? Well for me it used to depend on whether or not I am attending a Axis Seminar and was going to be in classes for a few days. Now that is not a issue.

The first Axis seminar I attended with Heavy was almost 5 years ago in Las Vegas. My bankroll was $3000 and that was based on being in Vegas for 6 days, playing 3 sessions a day and a $300 buyin. My loss limit was $175 per session. Then I played strictly red chips, passline, single or double odds and maybe 1 or 2 box numbers. I felt that, I would be in class a few days and when I was playing, if I hit my loss limit on 50% of the sessions, broke even on 25% and made a little bit on 25% that would be ok. Well that proved for me to be a good scenario of my bankroll plan. My first Axis Seminar was remarkable.

Now my bankroll is $5-6K for 6 days even if I am attending a weekend seminar or not. My buyin is around $800 and my loss limit is $350. I generally arrive Thursday evenings and will have 3 or 4 sessions under my belt by classtime. I still start off conversative, red chip bets, passline with double odds, 1 or 2 box numbers, but now if things look good, its up to Green chips. The nice thing about attending one of Heavys seminars, is if I'm getting my ass handed to me on a platter, in a day or so I'm on a table at a dealer school getting a toss tweak. There is nothing like a dozen eyes on your toss to get fixed whats broke.

Historically, my Vegas trips have worked out very good for me overall. Out of around 10 trips I believe only 2 were losers, few breakevens and half were on the plus side. My 2 Tunica trips were losers. I was down about 35% of my bankroll, and looking back the error of my ways was more improperly betting. Hopefully at Heavy's next month we can fix that.

I tend to split my bankroll into 2 sections (50%), one for my daily sessions and the other one that I really dont plan on dipping into. So far that has worked for me. Bankroll is also a state of mind. If I have $4 or 5k sitting in my safe and I am having a bit of bad luck, mentally I am not getting stressed. We all experience the tables where the toss is perfect the results are bad. Those sessions are just part of the 15-20 that I am playing and the sooner they are over the better. Limit the loss, go have a few or several cocktails and review what is happening. Cocktails and a good nights sleep is a remarkable way improving the dynamics of your toss issues. A fresh morning does wonders mentally.

Just my thoughts.....


Lkwd

For me bankroll is usually $2500 - $3500 for any gambling trip, be it one night or four.

If I am trying to gain more comps at a property, I Will buy in for a thousand or two, but never lose more than 6 or 8 hundred in a single session.

I have more confidence when I have "extra" cash with me, and extra chips in front of me.. just me saying..

WHen I see someone walk up and buy in for $100 or less, I usually go dark and more often than not, win. Scared money is a loser.

good luck to all
pradice

How about:
3day, 2 night stay. Any longer than that becomes a marathon for me. A concentration issue.
Trip Bankroll - $2000.
Session Buy in - $360. (I'm not interested in the comp fiasco)
Bet Size $60 (may be split between #s, ( i.e. a $30 place bet on the 6 & 8, $60 across, whatever is called for) with a maximum at risk of $120 at any time
Maximum allowable session loss of $180, then walk away. Pay as many sessions as you wish, with a suitable break in between.
Any thoughts?

Harvyrb

If you have $120 at risk on one shooter than $360 bankroll might not last too long.. Like 3 shooters at times.. IF Strict money management strategy is your goal, then with a $360 bankroll, you should have like $30 at risk to at least make it around the table once.

For me, most winning sessions I have, I start out down.. then grind my way up..

Don't underestimate the comp game, it can pay for almost everything..

pradice

A couple of things about that ~$500 trip bankroll.

That's been approximately the (self-declared) estimate for years now. I've seen other reports that say those same people lose that $500 and hit the ATM in a day or so. They underestimate their bankroll needs and/or don't admit they will withdraw and lose more.

Also, for years now, the percentage of visitors who report that "gambling"" is their principle reason to visit is dropping, especially as the club scene has grown. So they might expect to spend $1,000 but only half at gaming.

I've long felt that this is a contributing cause of the decline in table games. You can't expect to play craps on the Strip for 2 days with $500 if $10 tables are the low end. So these dollars go to slot machines, with smaller individual bet sizes but worse return on investment. It's killing craps for younger, less wealthy players.


-DC

.
A number of players establish a line of credit or or deposit some $$ in a cashier's account to
as a way to avoid packing TOO MUCH $$$$$$ around Sin City......An other way is to establish
a "Gaming Money " account with a home town bank having branches in Las Vegas..Handy if
the ATM machines belong to your bank and you want to avoid the A T M /convenience rip off fee(s) .

Also I may work out to deposit $$$$$$$$$$$$ from your winnings ( if any )

Pack around TOO MUCH $ and you may become a "TARGET" or even get "special attention" as
"a suspicious person" whatever that is...................

As a precaution , there are available clothing with secret pockets,pick pocket resistant clothing
and several tactical / conceal clothing manufactures like Scott Vest and Tactical 511

Just me saying

W C

Heavy wrote: I wanted to ask YOU guys is how much YOU pack to Vegas for a weekender - say four days and three nights - and how you apportion it for your sessions.

Hi Heavy. Good question. I'll budget about $3K for the entire trip. I budget $200 for blackjack/slots/roulette the first night, but only to wind down from travel. I don't hit the tables until the next day. I'll start with $1K for the day and I try to build it into something that propels me into the other days, I try to avoid dipping into the reserve. Sometimes it works, other times not so much. If I'm on the losing end, I stick to my loss limits and stay within my daily budget. 1st day $200, 2nd Day $1K-$1.4K, 3rd Day $1K-$1.4K. I'll break up the daily into session stakes. I don't gamble the last day. I try to get an early flight so I can take the money and run. I try to avoid Friday and Saturday nights if the tables are too busy. I like morning and early afternoon sessions. Like for most, it's maintaining the discipline that is tough. I'm still trying to master the money management part. I try to break up the time in the day by taking in the sights and visiting the different properties and their amenities. I'm one of those guys that has his whole itinerary for the weekend planned out before the plane lands at McCarran.

For me I'm going in September(as of now). might be tunica instead. I usually buy in for 300$ a session. I'd like to have 3k with me for the 3 days. That would be 2x what I normally take.

Without answering the question, I would like to make a point. If you don't count travel expenses, you can easily turn a skilled shot plus $100 into any win amount theoretically. Knowledge of the details and traffic patterns of the tables around town (and renting a car for your visit) is just about as important as anything else if you are truly serious about winning from skill around town.

If you're coming in with $2,000 and hoping to win $10,000 that's a lot easier to do than turning $100 into $4,000. I think that generally speaking you don't need much money at all to play the game and win about as much as you want to win if you have the time and knowledge and resources to travel.

The absolutely single biggest thing that gets in my way to making money at the tables is other people. It's not a bankroll.

The absolutely single biggest thing that gets in my way to making money at the tables is other people. It's not a bankroll.

Interesting observation, and perhaps a good topic for another thread. I'd say the biggest single obstacle to making money at the tables is greed. Of course, the answer to this question will likely vary from player to player.

IndieFilmGuy wrote:I play at Spirit Mountain here in Oregon

If there was ever any doubt that I'd played craps from coast to coast......here's another feather for the cap!

....tossed dice everywhere.....

I'm certainly in a different mindset than most (or at least those who have posted in this thread). I get to play almost every weekend and I take $300 with me each time I play. I don't have a bankroll so to speak. A $1200/month loss (while suckish) is within my budget these days.

If I have a winning weekend (say $300) then I come back next time with $600. I'm looking to build my stake into an empire or blow it all trying. So far, no empire. I will get there one day.