Heavy's Axis Power Craps Forum

Can't believe the ignorant masses, of so called AP's, on WoV, that think that way. Unfortunately, my favorite negative progression, The D'Alembert, invented for European Roulette, is very hard to adapt to craps and almost impossible for Blackjack. Boring too, for the action junkies.

Personally, I like the Fibonacci. Some people call is a "slow martingale." So what? Just because you're playing a "up as you lose" strategy does not mean you're playing a martingale. It does sort of of play into due number theory and the old "he can't possibly make another pass" deal when you're playing the Don'ts. Rarely CAN they make another pass, which is why I limit my progressive Lay betting mostly to Fire Bet games where I can Lay against the fourth, fifth, and sixth passes. But that's a horse of a different color.

How about this. If you are running your negative progression on the Free Odds bet ONLY are you really running a negative progression? Hmmm. That's almost worth its own topic.

heavy wrote:How about this. If you are running your negative progression on the Free Odds bet ONLY are you really running a negative progression? Hmmm. That's almost worth its own topic.

What you are referring to here is a situation where you are increasing your bet size on the Free Odds only in the event of one or more losing hands. So, the simplest example would be this:

1. You start a hand with a $10 Passline bet. It loses.
2. So you do another $10 passline bet and add $10 free odds. The shooter sevens out.
3. So you do another $10 passline bet and add $20 free odds. The shooter sevens out
4. So you do another $10 passline bet and add $30 free odds (three times the original lost passline wager).

The example above is definitely a negative progression, but it gets really cloudy for several reasons:
a.) The passline wager can be resolved without a point being established (craps, seven or 11 on comeout), but free odds cannot be established with a point number being rolled
b.) The payout on the free odds is not a flat 1:1 payout like the passline bet
c.) There are table limits on free odds bets that are easily reached (the most common is 3x4x5x odds)

A much better place to do a proportional negative progression would be on simply place or no place bet. So place the six, if it looses, double the wager, then triple the wager, etc.

I think it can be argued that increasing free odds can be leveraged as a "negative progression" betting scheme, or that its seperate and independant from any other bet going on.

I think that properly proportioned negative progression betting schemes become complex at a craps table when you place a combination of bets that have different odds, payouts, and EVs.

Classic Martingale or any other simple negative progression is simplest with flat bets that payout 1:1.





I think that it can be argued that you are both runni