$25 D.P.

[huey66]

I'm sure this play is on the forum somewhere but I wanted to throw it out and ask a couple questions.

1. Chart tables and look for choppy to cold.

2. Buy-in $300.

3. $25 D.P. with $1 yo. Lay the 5 or 9 for $31.

4. Once point is established place the 6 & 8 for $12 each.

If 7 rolls on C.O. I take the $20 from the lay and play it on the D.P.
11 on C.O. I play the $15 on the D.P.
If point is 4 or 10 I have been laying single odds. No odds on the other numbers. I have been pressing the 6 & 8 every other hit after the second hit but I'm thinking I might go to $22 inside after 1 hit and build from there. Not sure.

Do I put the $1 VIG up with my $30 lay or does that depend on the casino? Do I lose the $1 on a loss as well as the win? Also thinking maybe I should lay the 4 or 10 for $41 instead. Easier number to win on the DP. I could also wait until point is established and lay the point with a DC.
Thinking I might need to up my buy-in also. This play seems to work ok in Casino Huey.

Heading back to Vegas Nov. 27 staying at the D. Bouncy tables that might prove favorable to a dark side play

[Moe Bettor]

Yeah..you lose the $1vig on a loss. It's gone unless you take the bet back. Then they give you the buck also.This is a hedging system play and this is somewhere on the forum I believe. The problem is that a seven wipes out your place bets fast. Dollar yo, of course, won't replace the $25..why not $2? Vig collected up front on lay bets. Various on buy bets.

[huey66]

I guess a $2 yo makes more sense. I believe on a PSO I would be up $1 with the $12 6 & 8. Even money with a $1 yo and down $1 with a $2 yo.

[heavy]

What makes more sense to me is to do away with all of those hedge bets and just bet a $25 DP. Once the point is established Place the six and eight for $24 each. If that's too much place action for you then go with $18 or $12 each, but it takes two hits to put you in a guaranteed win situation. At $24 you're guaranteed a win for the hand after one hit on the six or eight.

Hedges ultimately eat into profits. Maybe not in the short run - but if you're a regular player then you need to consider eliminating them. I'll get into this in more depth on my What are the Odds thread in the weeks to come. Right now I'm getting my crap together so I can get to the airport and head to Vegas.

[220Inside]

The $25 DP with $24 6 and 8's is basically Shootitall's OHCM strategy.

[huey66]

That would be correct 22, But... I'm not pulling the place bets after first hit but am looking to build from a couple quick hits. This is the reason that the total of my place bets is equal or close to equal my DP wager. PSO does me no harm. Heavy might be right about the hedges killing me in the end. Might try leaving them naked after a few successful hands but I'm just more comfortable playing them.

I do enjoy playing the right side. Heat Seeker and the 6/8 Stretch Play are my two favorites to date. When the table turns this other play seems like a good option. More action than OHCM with the ability to catch an extended roll. Guess I'll find out in 2 weeks. Hope I'm not missing something.

[London Shooter]

I'd drop the yo hedge for sure. Such a high HA bet, there really is no point in bothering. As people say, what are you so scared about in placing a DP?

Now, for me the lay hedge is of more interest. $41 no 4 or 10 looks good in two ways. Firstly it is the lowest HA of the box number lays and secondly if you lose your lay then the DP travels to the least likely number for a repeat and therefore two losses on the play. I'd do that rather than the no 5 or 9

[huey66]

Makes sense on the yo. Here is the question on the lay bet. Do you pick your lay point, say the 4, and stick with that number for your session no matter what? I'm guessing you wouldn't hedge with the hard 4. Maybe a bad question. If you get knocked off say 3 times with the 4 showing it might be time to go or switch it up.

[London Shooter]

I'd be happy to pick either 4 or 10 and stick with it and work out a plan for how many bets or monetary value would be my loss limit for the session. No, I wouldn't hedge with a hard 4. You are already hedging your DP with a 4 or 10 lay, so hedging the hedge is just heading into a real mess

[Moe Bettor]

Agree totally LS on the method, but you are not hedging your DP with no 4 or 10 as you are putting out $41 to get $20 but if the number hits..say a 6 you lose your $20 DP and the $41 is still up there. A seven out will get you riches, but a more prudent move, imo, is say $15DP and then a $10 DC. SO and you have 5 bucks. Or $10 DC moves to a number..you are covered both ways.

[huey66]

$41 no 4 or 10 is up to hedge the $25 DP on the CO. Pull it down after point is established and work out and up from the 6/8 place. Might be less risky to go with the $15 DP, $10 DC. No hedging needed.

[220Inside]

The DP/DC play I like is Wizard's.

$25 DP
One point is established
$25 DC
Lay enough on the DP to cover the DC
Once DC travels, remove the lay on the DP
Wait for a decision.

[Americraps]

I like any play that lets me win on a short hand and win big on a long hand. The long hands are where the big money is.Along with a $12 6 /8, I've been using a $10 DP with a negative odds progression of 1x, 3x quit the don't for that shooter, then 2x, 6x for the next shooter. Any win goes back to 1x odds. My thoughts are that the 2 loss per shooter prevents you from losing a ton on a hot roller, while you still can make a ton on a long hand with the 6 & 8.

[huey66]

This is exactly what I'm trying to accomplish. Stay afloat through the short rolls and be there to benefit from the occasional heater. Just trying to fine tune the the optimum $ figure for the DP and place bets in comparison to each other. I feel the DP should be equal to or slightly greater than the sum of the 6/8 place bets.

[DarthNater]

Since we are reopening with higher minimums, I thought it might be helpful to bump this up ......

I’ve always liked the $25 DP. For the new normal, I’m thinking $30 DP then going $30 6 and 8 for my OHCM and watch for transition opportunities.

I also like a strategy similar to what LS mentioned above: $25 DP and $40 lays on the 4 and 10 on the come out as the shooter can’t make them both and a 7 nets out a win. If the comeout is four or ten then take down the other lay and put it on the DP as part of some double odds.

Before the break, I saw this played with black chips at Silverton to perfection on the 16 footer.

Just some thoughts, let’s hear some more.... what’s your Darkside play on a $25 minimum table??

DN8R

[Lkwd]

DN8R

When you play the $30 DP on the come out, do you hedge with a $5 world or does that statistically kill any advantage during that session?

Thanks


Lkwd

[DarthNater]

DN8R

When you play the $30 DP on the come out, do you hedge with a $5 world or does that statistically kill any advantage during that session?

Thanks

Lkwd

Lkwd,
Nope. I’m either doing the $30 DP to set up OHCM to be lurking for a transition play; or a $25 DC. The only time I bet a World is if I’m doing GWAG on my hand or another DI that I know that IS also playing GWAG.

Now some will disagree with this, but my preference is to leave the DP naked, if it goes down to a comeout, I come back with a $45 DP to support $42 6 and 8 bets.

Also as you know from our last class with Heavy, I also like a mini variant of the Choppy Table - Short Leash where with a $25 DP, I Replace it with a $40 DP and a $5 yo to now make the Yo a profit center. If the Yo hits its back to the $25 DP and a restart of the play. If the DP gets knocked again, I generally bail as obviously it’s not as cold as I want; however if I view it as a randy fluke, I might try another DP cycle. That’s the new quandary with on six Players per table now in the new abnormal - will we be as willing to leave the table knowing there are less opportunities elsewhere? For that I’m thinking with the higher Table minimums there will be less chasing, more grinding (so resist the hedges); and slower games.

The other thing I’m curious about is the quality of shooters we’ll encounter but that discussion is for another time

DN8R

[Moe Bettor]

I like the basic Irish play, but with lay odds on the DP and only do this on a charted table or I'm shooting for it. Am now able, pretty regularly, to throw a seven within 4 rolls. On my rig..which probably doesn't mean anything on the various stuff out there. Yeah.Who knows.