Heavy's Axis Power Craps Forum

I'd be interested what methods people use to track data at the casino.

I have been literally using a little black book. When I roll I track total rolls but also the hits in the 5,6,8,9. One casino I go to finds it interesting and doesn't give me grief but the other casino won't allow my book on the rail which makes it a little more challenging to record.

I just created a small mobile Google sheet to record total rolls, 5/9 hits, 6/8 hits, and +/- $ per shooter. It seems to be easier to be constantly on the smartphone as everybody else is as well.
I decided I should chart the table constantly (per Patrick) to help with trending and random shooters.

What else are people tracking and how?

The screen you depict may allow you to observe the score
both
.............................. horizontal X X X X X
and
.vertical O
.......... O
...........O
............O
............O
..........................................
Works in Baccarat / Mini Bac
and
other single events like Pass Line and Do Not Pass Line
.
perhaps allowing for rapid visualization of trending events EARLY IN A CYCLE ( or other Confirmation Bias )

OR
the absence of repeat hits possibly signaling an impending potential DARK SIDE Opportunity

( or Confirmation Bias of shorting hand roll #'s ...with MANY SEVEN OUT Terminated hands )

just me saying

w c

Still waiting for BoneTracker at the App Store!

better yet, BTWincraps

Run BT on google sheets. It's not fully functional, but all of the important stuff should work. Then you should be able to access it from your phone if that is really what you want to do.

Before I step forward on your suggestion, can I keep a running transpose? Say if I enter a dice result pair, based on Hardway set, would it give me srr’s on biaxial sets, all sevens sets, double pitch biaxials? This would be HUGE!!! One trip to bathroom and come back with real-time table intel!

It should. That part of BT should be functional in sheets.

Sounds good. So BT is an app? Are we talking just Android or Apple or both? Maybe Maddog can chime in here.

House of Orange wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:05 pm Sounds good. So BT is an app? Are we talking just Android or Apple or both? Maybe Maddog can chime in here.

BT is an Excel Spreadsheet/Workbook — NOT a stand alone "app."

You need something that will open it (BT).

Google Sheets is a freebie that will open it and then you can use BT (and yes, the Transpose sheet (tab) in BT works).

Google Sheets is one part of a web(browser) (or "cloud") based application "suite" where you can upload, then "share" (if you're inclined to or need to) or not, and use and/or modify spreadsheets, documents and other assorted things — all this means is that you can use whatever web/internet browser to access these Google based or cloud applications with either Apple, Android, or whatever...

However, Google Sheets is also available as — a standalone "app" that you can download for Apple or Android so you DON'T have to use your DATA on your cell phone to access it (Google Sheets) over the internet.

You can check what Google has here:

https://about.google/intl/en/products/? ... ctive=none

Google Sheets is waaaay down at the bottom.

Hope that helps...

BTW Sorry, but NONE of the Macros (roll entry, RBS, etc.) in BT will work, just like they DON'T work in OpenOffice — hey, whaddaya want for free? Everything? LOL!

YMMV

Jonah has it right. BT is just a spreadsheet that works in some capacity in any spreadsheet program. It's written to run with Microsoft Excel and is fully functional when using it. Using the BT spreadsheet in other spreadsheet applications will neuter some of its functionality that rely on proprietary Excel bits that do not translate to other programs. BT is not an app that you can install on a phone.

Google Sheets is Google's cloud based spreadsheet application. It has an app version that can be installed on your phone or it can run in a web browser.

Bandit,

- I also keep track of 6/8, 5/9 hits, but also 4/10. I don't necessarily bet those, but I like to see how my toss is progressing in the long run.
- I track single pitch, double pitch, etc..
- I do also note how the dice look in the air (are they rotating together, are they separating away from each other as they travel, etc.), how they bounce (did they roll back); I won't do this for every toss, but for ones that truly stand out as bad or good.
- I don't keep any info on random rollers. I don't see them as a viable source of income.

At home I just record this info onto excel.
In regards to the casino that gives you grief. Can you keep your notes on the drink rack, and take it out to record, then put it back underneath? In other words, is the grief that they want the chip rack only for chips, or do they think you slow down the game by recording?

Amazing that with our interests in transposing results of dice throws, no one has come up with squat. It would be a game changer for those who think outside the box.

Horn Hi Joe-

It's ok on the drink rail. It's just a little clumsy for me. My phone is a little easier to handle but I've only tried it out once so far.

And I don't get any heat....

The problem is that casinos frown upon a mobile device being used at the craps table especially if you are going to use it to track your own rolls. Easiest thing to do is use the chips tracker method (HEAVY can go into details on how you can track your rolls by using 1 dollar chips) or based on your betting. At the end of the roll you should be able to tell how many rolls you had and what numbers you hit based on your betting.

I think the casino would rather you use a pencil and paper rather than electronic device.

Not so. I compile thousands of tosses at just a few casinos. Grabbing a sample of say 72 tosses into the bathroom would be invaluable information as it gets input into a smart phone or tablet, to compare to long term results.

Although some trends can be Id’ed quickly like double pitches on hardway or all 7 sets, others require transposition to see what set would work better. The six basic sets, six double pitch there of, six number kiss sets, numbers don’t lie once they are imputed. The trend is my friend. Real time information is always better than hoping you have the exact same conditions on your next session. You might run into March Madness!

Thanks for all that. As in politics we will agree to disagree.

Listen I know what you say is true, but you have no idea about what I’m talking about. It’s not opinion, dice results are not opinions. Translating results is not opinions. I want immediate trend results to make sure they line up with my historical figures, those from real casino results not flights of fantasy based on home practice results. I’m not selling anything here, so just let it go.

Horn Hi Joe-

I use chips to record the roll info during the roll. Number of rolls total, then a chip for 5/9 hits and another chip for 6/8 hits.

When the roll is over I step back from the craps table and record the data. I had a quick session recently and it works pretty good. No heat from bosses. I need a few tweaks on my mini spreadsheet to make life easier but it should work ok.

Just tracking my rolls would be fairly simple. I want to track everyone's rolls.

Standard deviation? A normal data set accounts for 68% of the probable results.

Wouldn't this indicated in a limited session that 32% of the data will be outside of the statistical probability? It can be +/- our probability expectations for the session.

The statistical deviation is as likely to be more "+" than "-" or vice versa but I would suggest it rarely to never aligns in the short term with the statistical probability over millions of rolls to the degree of three deviations (99%) of the rolls being within the probable data set.

I understand Gamblers fallacy. I understand when people talk about trends they are using past rolls to try to predict future rolls.

But....in the short term limited number of rolls there is a 32% chance a seven will NOT show 1 in 6 rolls exactly. It could be more or less. Or for the individual trial example there is a 32% chance that a seven will not show 16.67% of the time.

Is there any value in determining if the standard deviation during the limited number of individual data points is greater (more data points within the probable outcome) or less?

I don't know.

How do you determine to bet Pass or Don't Pass? How do you determine if a table is cold/choppy/warm?

Grafsteins suggests the improbable is probable in the short term. He suggests you let the dice determine what to bet (instead of automatically placing the 6/8 say...).

We know that's not probable over millions of rolls but in a limited session of data points it's possible to be outside of the probability curve- in fact there's a 32% chance.

A past roll will not predict the future roll. It's just data in the end and you can create whatever model or rules you want that may or may not work in the short term.

I know that but I'll still watch the table and if there's two or three short rolls I'll change my betting strategy.

Irish,

Just curious, how do you track your variance?