Heavy's Axis Power Craps Forum

Greetings members,

I think this page should be for members to ask other members anything to do with gambling.

I will go first: FOR DarthNater... I know you are the best DONT player on this board.

I know other member know the answer to my question BUT DarthNater is the man when it comes to DONT betting.

If i play 10dollars on the don't pass line AND then play 10 dollars behind the 10 dollar don't pass bet,and i seven out, if the come out number is .......4 how munch do i win

5 how munch do i win

6 how munch do i win

8 how munch do i win

9 how munch do i win

10 how munch do i win.
Thank you...jaime.

The boards that heavy has set up are definitely a place to talk about craps and other types of gambling, but it's not a free for all (or it shouldn't be, IMO). The sub-boards break things down into general areas of discussion and then each topic thread posted by the members should be on topic for that sub-board. Similarly, replies to topics should be on topic as much as reasonably possible without hijacking threads which helps noone.

This one sure like a don't side craps related question to me. There's a sub-forum specifically for dark side craps. I'm going to move this topic out from "Games Other Than Craps" where is was originally posted to the more appropriate forum.

And getting back on topic, even though the question was directed right at Nate, I presume you don't mind if other members chime in

For 4/10, you would win $15 ($10 flat DP, plus $5 for the odds on the DP, paid at 1-2)
For 5/9, I think it would work out to $17 ($10 flat DP, plus $7 for the odds on the improperly sized odds bet, paid at 2-3)
For 6/8, I think it would work out to $19 ($10 flat DP, plus $9 for the odds on the improperly sized odds bet, paid at 6-7)

I'm sure Nate, or others, will either confirm or correct the above. We have lots of knowledgeable folks here.

Greetings 22Inside,

As i see it, the player is better off just betting the 20 dollars on the don't pass line?
DarthNater or 22Inside do you agree or not.

jaime.

For 4/10, you would win $15 ($10 flat DP, plus $5 for the odds on the DP, paid at 1-2).
$10 odds on 4/10 is a proper-sized odds bet. Total win: $15.

The 5/9 and 6/8 are being backed by the incorrect or improper odds bet of $10
so here are the gory details you may or may not have wanted:

If the dealer failed to notice your improper odds bet of $10 and it wins, they
would divide the excess bet(over the lower properly-sized odds bet) by the
proper odds denominator and get a real number, meaning a number that may
contain a fraction.
Since the casino can only deliver integer (whole number) amounts as low as a
single white chip or zero, they will round the real number to the nearest
lower integer amount. Ex: $1.50 rounds to $1. $3.88 to $3, $.96 to zero, etc.

For 5/9, the excess odds bet would be $1 (10 minus 9).
Divide $1 by 3 (3 units pays 2 units on the win) to get $.33 per unit.
So $1 odds in excess would have the fractional payout of 66 2/3 cents or $0.66
( 3 x .33 1/3 pays 2 x .33 or .66). Round this payoff down to the nearest
integer which gets you to zero.

The casino will pay your $10 odds bet with only $6 instead of $6.66 which is
technically what the 3:2 odds calculates the payout to be. Total win: $16.

For 6/8, the excess odds bet would be $4 (10 minus 6).
Divide $4 by 6 (6 units pays 5 units on the win) to get 66 2/3 cents or $.66 per unit.
So $4 in excess odds would have the fractional payout of $3.33
(6 x .66 pays 5 x .66 or 3.33). Round this payoff down to the nearest integer, three.

The casino will pay your $10 odds bet with only $8 instead of $8.33 which is
technically what the 6:5 odds calculates the payout to be. Total win: $18.

Thanks onebok. I did not handle the excess portion of the improper sized 5/9 and 6/8 odds bets correctly in my post. Your detailed analysis makes a lot more sense. It's why I always make right sized odds bets and specifically ask if I'm not sure so that there is no confusion.

Jaime. Many gamblers believe that laying odds on the Don'ts "weakens" their Don't Pass or Don't Come bet. For example, if you have a $25 DP bet on the NINE and you Lay $60 odds you have a total of $85 action. If the shooter sevens out you win $25 on the flat bet and $40 on the odds for a total of $65 won. Had you bet the entire $85 on the DP you'd have won $85. The problem is getting that $85 past the "sheriff and the deputy." You'd end up spending more than you'd potentially win hedging and cross hedging to protect that $85 on the Come Out. Even then you'd end up losing money on it to the house edge. It's just simple math. And remember, the house has ZERO edge on the Free Odds bet. Like it or not.

I like to take another direction in explaining this, though. Right side players always turn their noses up at playing the Don'ts for this very reason. They don't like risking more to win less. So let's look at "Spence the Spreader," who likes to get action all over the table. He walks up and sees the point is Nine so he immediately drops "Eighty-five inside - excluding the point." So the dealer sets him up with $25 on the Five and $30 each on the Six and Eight. Now what is old Spencer risking? He's risking $85 on each roll of the dice to win $35. Meanwhile old Dickie the Darksider has $85 at risk to win $65 and THE SEVEN IS WORKING FOR HIM. Who is in the more powerful position? Spencer or Dickie? On a hot hand Spencer will do okay, but he has to get three hits to come out. How likely it that? Odds are over the long run they'll probably both lose a little money, but Spencer is going to lose more. Dickie is sitting in the cat bird seat because the larger portion of his bets has zero house edge exposure and the seven is working for him. And both of these guys are risking more to win less.

I think Onebok answered the question perfectly. You need to size your don’t odds correctly in order to maximize the payouts. If you don’t want think think then just use $30 increments as x$30 works for any don’t lay odds.

DN8R

Ps there are a lot of don’t betters on this board, as well as many at the casinos, that I have learned a lot from, and I’m still learning so I would never claim to be the greatest at this, just happy to be netting out ahead, cheers......

Greeting heavy,

like always, you are driving the Bus.

I thought playing the 20 dollars, was the right bet, again you came up with the right answer.

When you go to the casino, the casinos are in big trouble, they are lucky you never became a full time craps player.

jaime.

Or no lay odds. Just a $20 DP, and a $15 come bet after the pt. PSO, you win $35. Seven later, you win $5. Meanwhile if you see a couple repeaters..and a hand forming..

DarthNater wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 1:27 pm I think Onebok answered the question perfectly. You need to size your don’t odds correctly in order to maximize the payouts. If you don’t want think think then just use $30 increments as x$30 works for any don’t lay odds.

Since the dealers seem to be moving the dice faster these days, when im laying odds, $30 works on everything is all i can remember.

Since the dealers seem to be moving the dice faster these days, when im laying odds, $30 works on everything is all i can remember.

That is correct. $30 or MULTIPLES of $30. So you can Lay $30, $60, $90, $120, etc. on any number and have a correct be as long as you're within their table limits.

heavy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 1:31 am

Since the dealers seem to be moving the dice faster these days, when im laying odds, $30 works on everything is all i can remember.

That is correct. $30 or MULTIPLES of $30. So you can Lay $30, $60, $90, $120, etc. on any number and have a correct be as long as you're within their table limits.

Learned that in vegas class ..