Heavy's Axis Power Craps Forum

Anyone playing Professor H's don't pass progression ? Have you played it in the past.How did you do? Trying to find a don't strategy to play.I'm going to try a couple of Dr.Dices plays next week. Any suggestions ?

Well, after all these years it seems I've lost Professor H's Don't Pass Progression. No doubt there is still a copy on my old desktop computer, but it hasn't made it over to this new one yet. I did a couple of articles on Don't play through the years that included elements of Professor H's play, including one that was a Free Odds progression. The Don't strategies I like best, though, tend to be based more on flat betting. I may use the odds, but when I do it is usually when I am in recovery mode.

For example, in a $10 game I might play a $15 Don't Pass followed by a $10 Don't Come. At that point I will wait for a decision. If I get knocked off either bet then I lay sufficient odds on the remaining number to recover the amount lost on the bet that got knocked off.

The other progression I'll play sometimes when I'm dead-heading it at the table, just waiting for a clear cut trend is the fibonacci. That's a negative progression of 1 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 5 - 8 - 13 - 21 - 34 - etc. If you hit a win at any level you stay at that level for one more hit. If you lose on that hit you continue the progression. Any time you hit two wins in a row you regress to the initial 1 unit level. I could probably count the number of times I've progressed beyond 8 units on one hand - if I drop $200 running a fibo in a $10 game I'm pretty much done with it.

Hopefully one of the other guys - maybe Golfer or DF - can chime in and remind us about their take on Professor H's old play.

Short version was a unit or 2 units if I remember correctly. DF might be in Tunica, he will know for sure. Have to wait til he gets back.

I found it on my other computer. It's going to be a few hours before I can get it copied over to the new machine and uploaded, but I'll get 'er done if nobody beats me to it.

Googled and this is what popped up:

http://www.dicesetter.com/craps_strategy/strat19.htm

Not sure if this is what you want but I'll look through more of what I've squirreled away over the years. - Kelph

Professor H's Don't Pass Strategy

Professor H's method of play on the Don't is intended to accomplish two things:
(1) playing time, and (2) occasional comparatively large wins.

Lay odds progressively, increasing the Don't pass line bet only after reaching the maximum table odds.

To lay odds progressively, use an odds table similar to the one below. This odds table is for use with an initial don't pass line bet of $5 beginning with 1x odds.

The far left column contains the number of consecutive 7-outs, the line bet, and the odds won in multiples of the line bet.

The columns under the point numbers contain the dollar amount of the odds laid, and, in bold, the payoff on the odds.

This table begins with 1x odds, increasing to 2X after three consecutive 7-outs.

Naturals and craps are ignored when counting consecutive 7-outs.

After the third 7-out in a row, the total amount won increases by one initial line bet ($5 in this case) with each successive win. In other words, row 3 wins a total of $10, row 4 $15, row 5 $20, row 6 $25, row 7 $30, and so on. This progression is conservative, and results from some odds wagers winning fractional multiples of the line bet when the line bet is $10.

Do not make any Don't come bets. (If you have a bankroll large enough to make don't come bets, begin with 2x or 3x odds, rather than 1x odds.)

After any point is made (won), start over at line 1.

To minimize losses to a run of winning points, either (1) switch to the Pass line, playing your favorite Pass line method, (2) do not lay odds on the Don't pass line bet, or (3) stop betting on the shooter until he/she sevens-out.

Kelph - I'm not about to try BBCode so here are the column titles and you can set them above after straightening the columns in Excel. There's got to be an easier way to do this.

Column 1 is # of 7 - outs
Column 2 is Flat DP Bet
Column 3 is Odds Multiplier
Column 4 is 6- 8 odds amount
Column 5 is Odds amount paid if won
Column 6 is 5-9odds amount
Column 7 is Odds amount paid if won
Column 8 is 4-10odds amount
Column 9 is Odds amount paid if won

1 5 1 6 5 9 6 10 5
2 5 1 6 5 9 6 10 5
3 5 1 6 5 9 6 10 5
4 5 2 12 10 15 10 20 10
5 5 3 18 15 24 16 30 15
6 5 4 24 20 30 20 40 20
7 5 5 30 25 39 26 50 25
8 5 6 36 30 45 30 60 30
9 5 7 42 35 54 36 70 35
10 5 8 48 40 60 40 80 40
11 5 9 54 45 69 46 90 45
12 5 10 60 50 75 50 100 50
13 10 5 60 50 75 50 100 50
14 10 5.5 66 55 84 56 110 55
15 10 6 72 60 90 60 120 60
16 10 6.5 78 65 99 66 130 65
17 10 7 84 70 105 70 140 70
18 10 7.5 90 75 114 76 150 75
19 10 8 96 80 120 80 160 80
20 10 8.5 102 85 129 86 170 85
21 10 9 108 90 135 90 180 90
22 10 9.5 114 95 144 96 190 95
23 10 10 120 100 150 100 200 100

If you don't want to use BB code you can always save an excel sheet as an image and then upload the image to tinypic and link to it.

Let's see if this works - Kelph

Thanks guys.Thats what I was looking for.
Anyone played it for any period of time ?
I'm having a hard time making myself play the don'ts.

Michael,

I'm sure you know this negative expectation game is the same on the right side as the wrong side...........

And just to expand on that a bit - if you play the right side you have a serious advantage over the Don'ts on the Come Out roll. Eight ways to win versus four ways to lose. However, if you don't win on the Come Out then the odds shift against you - something like 3 - 2 if you're on the right side. At the end of the day the Don'ts give you a slight edge over the Do's, but only very slight. It's almost a coin flip.

But when the table turns cool and goes to cold I want a don't strategy to use.

I used Professor H`s Dont Pass Odds Progression Strategy back in the day.

Professor H didn`t give a damn about winning and didn`t give a damn about losing. All he wanted to do is play. He knew he was playing a negative game. Playing the odds progression , was his way of keeping himself alert at the table and keeping his juices flowing as the odds wager increased.

The good thing about the Odds Progression was that you increased the odds after wins. The bad thing about the Odds Progression is the last wager you lost.

Professor H would lose three times to comeout naturals before he would quit betting on a shooter and then he would pick up wherever he was in the Odds Progression with the next shooter.

I only lost one time on comeout naturals on a shooter and after that loss, I would start back at the beginning of the Odds Progression.

The reason == Professor H had a big Bankroll====Dylanfreake had a small bankroll.

Toward the end of Professor H`s posting days , right after the Allcraps board went out of existence, Professor H and I had begun using what we called equal odds on each number established.

EX: $5 12(10) 12(8) 12(6)
18(15) 18(12) 18(9)
24(20) 24(16) 24(12)
etc.

What equal odds did was to take the sting out of losing that last wager when the point was a 4 or 10.

I think Professor H told me that the farthest he had gone into his progression was 16 wins in a row before a loss.

Looking at some old notes from 2001-2002, the farthest I ever went into the progression was 10 wins in a row before a loss.

Probably the best wager to make by a player waiting for the table to turn hot is to just make a table minimum flat DP wager .

Professor H just played without worrying about tables being hot or cold.

Golfer , I bet remembers this . Professor H talked about wins and losses being AIWs (Average Initial Wagers). His beginning AIW on a DP of $5 and single odds ($6 $9 $10) was 11.2 ($11.20).

Memory Lane

This may be somewhat leading astray.........However I am wondering ..........

A string of P/L or D/P ( trend/run ? ) numbering to TEN [ 10 ] or even SEVEN [ 7 ] DECISIONS
runs into being considered a TREND or at least a RUN . Our actual live casino exposure is
in the " short run time span " as opposed to the "long run time span " of infinity or eternity........

(O K , O K For purests among us, I know ETERNITY marks no time because it is ETERNITY)

For those keeping historical recording ( CHARTING ) of actual in casino hands : What are the frequencies of less than three ( 3 ) rolls on one extreme and perhaps greater than twelve(12) rolls on the other extreme............

I wonder because of the true-ism , a MONSTER ROLL is followed by several P S O hands
( or some small number of rolls)..........

Conversely , would perhaps four ( 4 ) back to back D/P decisions be an indicator that the trend was about to reverse

Were a fellow looking for a trend or run , how long would he look before jumping to GO WITH THE TREND On the other side of the equation , should a player be on the incorrect of the DECISIONS ,
HOW LONG IS WISE TO ENDURE?? before switching or just walking off

Just me musing

W C

You ride that horse until it drops stone cold dead and the buzzards start circling.

You know WC

Heavy posted a Pass Dont Pass strategy that has some decent legs. You need to ask Heavy about it, but basically you follow the P/DP trend and bet the last event? Not too sure hoe he did it. But I knoe for sure there is a guy on this forum who uses that method and makes 3-8 units depending on the trend. There are certain indicators that constitute a hot roll might be developing. However, does one really know?

Here's another "classic" thread from way back when. Those of us who were around the Internet forums in the late 90's and early 00's remember Professor H well. Professor H was a college instructor out on the left coast. He liked nothing better than playing craps. When he went to Vegas he wanted to spend every minute of his time at the craps table - even if his pants were soaked from the shrimp cocktail he dumped in his lap at lunch. Yeah, there's a story there. Anyway, as DF noted in the comments here, Professor H didn't really care if he won or lost as long as he got to spend many hours at the table - it was all about getting as much time in as possible for his gaming buck. Over the course of the years he came up with his own progression he played on the Don't Pass that worked extremely well for him when a series of Don't decisions occurred. Scroll up to the top and read the thread in its entirety - and feel free to add your own comments.

Professor H mostly stayed at Paris Casino in the days before it was owned by CET but he would play all along the strip. Billy the Kid who posted on the boards back in those days told me in Tunica ,a few years ago, that he was on the strip playing back in the day and noticed a darkside player at the other end of the table. Billy, after returning home, posted a trip report and Professor H posted one and they were playing at the same table.

A couple of things that I do in my play today are the results of messages Professor H and I exchanged .

Before I ever heard of Sam Grafstein, Professor H was limiting his losses to one bet per shooter, as far as the odds wager was concerned. He would lose three DP wagers to naturals before he quit betting on that shooter. (I`m more conservative , I only lose one bet of any kind per shooter).

When I played Professor H`s Dont Pass Odds Progression , I always hated it when I was behind for the session and I hit a good progression of 4,5 or 6 wins in a row and then get the number of 4 or 10 established and lay that large amount of odds and get smashed by the shooter making his point , wiping out hard fought profit on a table that was cold up to that sting of wins.

Because of my complaining about that , we came up with laying equal odds on all points.

Example: $5 DP $12(10) $12(8) $12(6)
$5 DP $18(15) $18(12) $18(9) on and on

By laying equal odds , It takes the sting out of losing that last bet in a progression when the point is a 4 or 10 or even a 5 or 9.

This was my bread and butter play during my early years of craps play , really up until I started COWTIPPIN'. The reason the Prof H DP odds Progression worked for me is that I left the table when ahead, instead of playing forever , like Professor H who would play 8 hours or so per day.

The reason the Prof H DP odds Progression worked for me is that I left the table when ahead, instead of playing forever , like Professor H who would play 8 hours or so per day.

Yep. I've said for years that the secret to winning is to quit when you're ahead. And if you never get ahead - stick by a firm (small) loss limit and get out of the casino before you empty your wallet.

I'm interested in this thanks for bringing it up. I'm still trying to work out how to make this play. I'll have another look later tonight to try to understand it with WinCraps. Does anyone have a bet file for this play?

The original table in Kelph's details I couldn't read, and the image he converted is long gone.

Here is the table.
[tr][td][b]# 7 outs[/b][/td][td][b]Flat DP Bet[/b][/td][td][b]Odds Multiplier[/b][/td][td][b]6/8 Odds Amount[/b][/td][td][b]Odds Amount Paid If Won[/b][/td][td][b]5/9 Odds Amount[/b][/td][td][b]Odds Amount Paid if Won[/b][/td][td][b]4/10 Odds Amount[/b][/td][td][b]Odds Amount Paid If Won[/b][/td][/tr] [tr][td]1[/td][td]5[/td][td]1[/td][td]6[/td][td]5[/td][td]9[/td][td]6[/td][td]10[/td][td]5[/td][/tr] [tr][td]2[/td][td]5[/td][td]1[/td][td]6[/td][td]5[/td][td]9[/td][td]6[/td][td]10[/td][td]5[/td][/tr] [tr][td]3[/td][td]5[/td][td]1[/td][td]6[/td][td]5[/td][td]9[/td][td]6[/td][td]10[/td][td]5[/td][/tr] [tr][td]4[/td][td]5[/td][td]2[/td][td]12[/td][td]10[/td][td]15[/td][td]10[/td][td]20[/td][td]10[/td][/tr] [tr][td]5[/td][td]5[/td][td]3[/td][td]18[/td][td]15[/td][td]24[/td][td]16[/td][td]30[/td][td]15[/td][/tr] [tr][td]6[/td][td]5[/td][td]4[/td][td]24[/td][td]20[/td][td]30[/td][td]20[/td][td]40[/td][td]20[/td][/tr] [tr][td]7[/td][td]5[/td][td]5[/td][td]30[/td][td]25[/td][td]39[/td][td]26[/td][td]50[/td][td]25[/td][/tr] [tr][td]8[/td][td]5[/td][td]6[/td][td]36[/td][td]30[/td][td]45[/td][td]30[/td][td]60[/td][td]30[/td][/tr] [tr][td]9[/td][td]5[/td][td]7[/td][td]42[/td][td]35[/td][td]54[/td][td]36[/td][td]70[/td][td]35[/td][/tr] [tr][td]10[/td][td]5[/td][td]8[/td][td]48[/td][td]40[/td][td]60[/td][td]40[/td][td]80[/td][td]40[/td][/tr] [tr][td]11[/td][td]5[/td][td]9[/td][td]54[/td][td]45[/td][td]69[/td][td]46[/td][td]90[/td][td]45[/td][/tr] [tr][td]12[/td][td]5[/td][td]10[/td][td]60[/td][td]50[/td][td]75[/td][td]50[/td][td]100[/td][td]50[/td][/tr] [tr][td]13[/td][td]10[/td][td]5[/td][td]60[/td][td]50[/td][td]75[/td][td]50[/td][td]100[/td][td]50[/td][/tr] [tr][td]14[/td][td]10[/td][td]5.5[/td][td]66[/td][td]55[/td][td]84[/td][td]56[/td][td]110[/td][td]55[/td][/tr] [tr][td]15[/td][td]10[/td][td]6[/td][td]72[/td][td]60[/td][td]90[/td][td]60[/td][td]120[/td][td]60[/td][/tr] [tr][td]16[/td][td]10[/td][td]6.5[/td][td]78[/td][td]65[/td][td]99[/td][td]66[/td][td]130[/td][td]65[/td][/tr] [tr][td]17[/td][td]10[/td][td]7[/td][td]84[/td][td]70[/td][td]105[/td][td]70[/td][td]140[/td][td]70[/td][/tr] [tr][td]18[/td][td]10[/td][td]7.5[/td][td]90[/td][td]75[/td][td]114[/td][td]76[/td][td]150[/td][td]75[/td][/tr] [tr][td]19[/td][td]10[/td][td]8[/td][td]96[/td][td]80[/td][td]120[/td][td]80[/td][td]160[/td][td]80[/td][/tr] [tr][td]20[/td][td]10[/td][td]8.5[/td][td]102[/td][td]85[/td][td]129[/td][td]86[/td][td]170[/td][td]85[/td][/tr] [tr][td]21[/td][td]10[/td][td]9[/td][td]108[/td][td]90[/td][td]135[/td][td]90[/td][td]180[/td][td]90[/td][/tr] [tr][td]22[/td][td]10[/td][td]9.5[/td][td]114[/td][td]95[/td][td]144[/td][td]96[/td][td]190[/td][td]95[/td][/tr] [tr][td]23[/td][td]10[/td][td]10[/td][td]120[/td][td]100[/td][td]150[/td][td]100[/td][td]200[/td][td]100[/td][/tr]